This probably only concerns the small group of players that:
haven’t played before 1.0 to build up legacy stash tabs
want to play legacy now
But for us, well for me at least the omission of our paid and earned stash tabs is very close to deleting everything and not offer legacy at all.
In PoE you never fall below the amount of stash tabs you had unlocked simultaneously. There is a merging process whenever a league ends, but I never got reduced to zero tabs. I only had to merge X new tabs with Y old tabs, with Y >= X in all cases.
I cannot start legacy on thursday if I have to refarm 50+ million gold before picking up any new item. Please tell me this is an oversight for you promised us to continue with our “save game” created in cycle 1 and now you’ve transferred a severely damaged file.
Please read the other topic as well for more. and most of all please fix this soon
edit: see post 16 for my most recent catch-all idea
Can you clarify this? Are you talking about Cycle characters that have been migrated to Legacy, or pure Legacy characters?
Nvm - didn’t read the whole post carefully enough. The Cycle merge didn’t work for me in any capacity: stash tabs nor loot. Since I’ve been playing almost exclusively Legacy, it didn’t affect me much.
When I logged in and discovered that the only stash tabs I had access to were remove only, I honestly thought I was encountering a bug. Especially after using the “Merge Materials and Resources” button.
I am utterly at a loss as to what the thought process is here. I’m just supposed to re-purchase all of the stash tabs that I previously had, in order to be able to actually add anything to my stash? The complete disrespect of my time and effort is mind boggling and makes me not even want to engage with the 1.1 Cycle content. I can’t believe I have to say this, but in a game such as an ARPG, where one of the primary motivators to play is collecting loot, you don’t just take away a player’s ability to collect loot after they have invested time and in-game resources to this end.
There needs to be a hotfix, forthcoming very quickly, which causes the “Merge Materials and Resources” to duplicate the number of tabs and tab structure from 1.0 to legacy. If players have already purchased additional legacy tabs, then they can be refunded the gold utilized, and the purchased tabs can be converted to remove only. And I’d settle for any other alternative which ensures that the gold I spent on stash tabs in 1.0 Cycle is not shot into the ether.
You’ve managed to take a patch that I was excited for, and turn that excitement into disappointment, disgust, and a deep wariness of any future decisions that may be made around respecting the players’ invested time.
Alright, so I started playing in 1.0 cycle, now I want to continue in legacy. I got 70 tabs full of stuff I farmed. What do I do? Do I buy 70 tabs again and transfer all of the items there manually? Instead of having it transferred in 1 click? really?
does this stay this way, or is there any hotfix coming which will mess it up even more?
I mean to be fair, → in the end you just need to buy the 200 Stashtabs only ‘once’ for legacy and you won’t need to do it ever again, they themself don’t get reset. You only ‘lose’ the stashtabs/money spent on them in the cycle. (I mean they could potentially when you merge give you the gold back you spent on stashtabs when they’re remove only in Legacy realm)
And by the way that’s pretty common for this Genre, i don’t remember any ARPG (does maybe PoE do this?) where season-tabs get carried over to the legacy, they also just send the items to you and you need to clear that at time…
I mean sure, it would be at one hand cool, if each Cycle adds more Stashtabs (like Vanilla started out with 200 max, with C2 we would’ve 400 because C1 200 Stashtabs got added to it and so on). Tho that would be kinda unfair towards the folks who join later and miss out on the additional stashtabs - except they add it globally accessable for everyone no matter if they were part of the Cycle or not.
However that could at the other Hand also End ‘bad’ because if you’re 5 season in and have access to 1000 Stashtabs, players sometimes can be their own worst enemies and hoarders ruin the game for themself, because going through 1000 Stashtabs, even with searchfunctionality and such, becomes a pain in the 'ss and people unlearn to properly filter out legit/good items vs actual trash.
That’s why i’m gonna honest with you, i don’t mind either way… and i don’t see this as an issue, tho i would find it great/cool if the the cycle stash (the dropdown thingy) - even if remove only/oneway, because than we don’t have to hassle ourself to get the stuff out super fast and into the permanent legacy stash, or potentially lose our items (esp. if you forget about them).
What geniunly frustrates me tho, and i hope that’s a QoL Feature they can add one day → maybe even allow similiar to ‘Lootfilter’ to copy&paste/clipboard it:
I want a functionality where i can save and re-use my complete stash-layout in category and stashes. They don’t need to be ‘unlocked’ and i’m fine if you only can do it when you boot up the first time cycle/stash, but i don’t want to go through everything again and set up my sorting/layout-system. I want to see every category and stash i’ve organized and than click on the specific ‘stash’ to purchase/unlock them.
Was my first thought as well before the second came into my head.
What if an overflow happens from the reimbursed gold?
That can be a problematic issue and hence it’s not worth to implement as the downside is fairly miniscule.
Yes, PoE does this. They have the same ‘remove only’ system as LE. The difference is that you buy the tabs with actual money, hence they need to unlock it simultaneously in all leagues. Which LE doesn’t since you unlock them with in-game currency, hence they should stay contained unlock-wise for the respective cycle as well as an argument.
I would like them being added to legacy as well… but once again, overflow + merging issues.
Also it’s not sustainable for server capacity reasons, hence why there’s a 200 tab limit in the first place rather then a ‘infinite’ one.
Trust me… I can easily handle 1000 or even 2000 tabs, I have sorting systems for them in mind and will gladly put the items in accordingly every week or so until in 5 years I’ll need this one singular item which from all the other crap I have collected and fits ‘just right’… and that alone would make it worthwhile for me to do.
But yeah, without actual sorting systems people would screw themselves over.
Why? You set them up once in cycle and once in Legacy. In Cycle they build up naturally as you need to unlock them over time anyway. Also how would you prioritize which one gets added first? And what if you need to manually add another one since you need it at the moment for whatever reason? It’s not a very feasable option to implement simply.
Mike has said before in his stream that he’d like to have a system where the gold spent on tabs in cycle gets used for new tabs in legacy. So if you have 0 tabs in legacy and 50 in cycle, you’d get 50 tabs automatically. And if you had 50 tabs in legacy and used enough gold to buy 2 tabs in legacy, it would also add those.
Lately he replied regarding this in a thread about this issue that it’s still something he’d like to do, but there are no plans for it at the moment.
There’s a hard limit on the number of tabs you can have. It was 200 pre-launch, don’t know if they changed it since.
@Kulze@DJSamhein
Yeah i forgot to mention the technical aspect as well tho i wasn’t sure if they really have a 200 limit - i mean consider this - we already have pretty much double the amount of stashtabs in legacy already, which sounds to me they found a workaround. Maybe the stashfile(-system) they use have a hard limit and the way they do this in this drop-down menu is that it simply loads in a separate stashfile (from the cycle) - so i’m not sure if that’s really a thing. About capacity maybe, i dunno… do you think that the stashfiles itself are that big? Stuff like this - especially as someone which is in it’s free time rn trying to learn programing myself, would be pretty interesting on a technical level for me.
Tho to be fair, i wouldn’t consider you or most of us other forum-gremlins here as the ‘average player’. If you’re more invested and try to structure it through it will be less off an problem. But for the average joe; which just want to hoard and hoard and mindlessly throw it into stashtabs; can end up to walk past the point of return where they are so overwhelmed with the amount of lood… without any sense and proper sorting, that they lose motivation. That’s why i always understood why Crate was so against adding that many stashtabs in GD and rather let it outsource to tools/mods - because you’ll have then more likely folks who go this length which actually know to sort stuff out and such. For the Average Joe it’s too much of an hassle.
Because i prefer a homogenous and consistent layout/sorting system. That’s why i even made a lootfilter-template which i copy & paste for all my builds - where i just re-adjust the affixes and such which i need for my classes. It makes it more readable and visible for me. Of course it can lead to the problem - like right now with the new functionality added of LP & WW Filter, that i’ve to alter / overhaul it and than for all classes, but it feels still more structured and accessable that way.
And about my suggestion, maybe i should re-iterate / explain it better how i actually mean it.
Let’s just say i’ve C1 set up my complete Stash/Sorting-System. Wait i drop some screenshots(don’t mind some of the german words):
Now the way i meant my QoL Suggestion was: Everything you see here… you can copy / clipboard it into the next cycle - you already see all stashes and stuff, and how you tagged and such… but they aren’t accessable yet. But each stash specific you’ve a dedicated button where click “buy this stashtab” → how it’s visually presented is up to EHG - they can maybe grey it out a bit and add chains and stuff (similiar to the one in the passive-class tree) or whatever. And about the “how does the system know which one” as i pointed out you pick the stashes you want to unlock first… the only one which needs to be considered and i feel that’s more on the player side, would be the first stash in the first category/first spot… but when this QoL Feature would exist and people know that’s the minor limitation that you’ve at the first spot something universal working, than i don’t see it as an issue.
And about the “if you need to alter / add etc” → i mean on my side i don’t think i would really alter much, but again i wouldn’t see an issue with it… because my suggestion is for the most part - how to phrase it the best way - more like an preview or blueprint. It doesn’t mean you can’t add or alter something - just that you carry over your basic layout/potentiall stashes, but you stil could remove / add / alter something.
It’s just a QoL where you don’t need constantly (like i do right now because the screenshots i didn’t took for you but for myself so i always can check up how i did it in the last season) check up screenshots and such.
/Edit:
Also i want to add, i don’t know how easily / hard this would be to implement and worth it for most people in EHG eyes… that’s up to them to look at such suggestion, check how easy or hard it would be to implement and if it’s worth it. I’m just dropping my personal suggestion because that’s already one thing which i know will get on my nerves every season i play.
/Edit 2:
And yes i know in the screenshots i didn’t merge my stuff, but don’t worry… i did already. At that time i was just checking how it works and waited for a friend to check discord-stream to show him as well… and while i was waiting i thought i will screenshot my sorting-system…
Hey hey! Don’t call me a forum-gremlin… I’m a proud loot-goblin too after all!
But yeah, I got to live out my hoarding urges somewhere, games like LE are perfect for that.
Also I’m a bona-fide OCD hoarder, everything needs their own space. Every item type, subcategory for exalted tier ranges and so on and so forth, 200 is already not working out for me, but that’s just a ‘me’ thing and definitely not normal.
Yeah, but unlike PoE here in LE we have actual true proper starting conditions for each cycle. Which means no upsides of any kind for any player. We all start at the exact same place, the beginning tabs being one of those.
It was always a downside for PoE players that free players couldn’t compete in races with people who’ve bought premium tabs, have their affinities setup, dump tabs and so on and so forth.
This aspect is one which LE is actually superior compared to PoE currently, which is why I’m against adjusting that.
I personally am no racer… but I acknowledge that such events - official or community driven doesn’t matter there - are a big big advertisment for the game. It’s enjoyable to follow and for some to participate, especially for Twitch viewers it’s prime content which is perfectly prepared for streamers already. It’s just a massive reach without cost for the company and nowadays you need as much of that as possible.
Ahhh, so basically a sort of ‘preview’ which you then unlock piece by piece?
Yeah, that sounds like a great solution for the whole setup, I would be very much up for that, especially if you can save different presets for that personally, hence fitted to Softcore, Hardcore, Legacy… all great.
I would imagine… not extremely hard. Sure, it would need a bit of effort but definitely lower on the ‘effort scale’ then some other suggestions which are vastly less impactful for the game.
So I’m all for it. Especially since it’s not seen anywhere else and provides a clear-cut upside for organization, having to do the thing only once and then being ‘good to go’ basically.
First, that assumes that you already had 200 tabs in legacy and that you bought another 200 in cycle. Which isn’t likely. I’d say that vast majority of cycle players don’t have more than 50 tabs, at most. And even most legacy players won’t have much more than 50 either.
Second, there’s a difference between a stash tab that is dynamic and where you can put stuff in and out at wil and a static list of tabs where you can only take things out and will disappear once it’s empty.
Third, it remains to be seen if when cycle 2 ends and cycle 3 starts, if the cycle 1 remove-only tabs are removed (like in D2/D3/D4) or if they are kept (like in PoE).
200 was the limit as confirmed by Mike on several occasions before 1.0. I don’t think they changed it since I can’t find it in patch notes.
Each stash tab has every item saved in there (as well as position). This is database space that is being occupied by every single player. With thousands of players, it adds up quick. Which is why there are hard limits for these things, even if 200 is something barely anyone would ever need.
This is a nice idea, although I expect most people don’t bother creating such a complex system. It would still be a nice QoL, but way down the priority list. With the added disadvantage that you’d need to save the stash layout.
I’d see it more easily being implemented as copying from your legacy setup.
True, sorry for doing mischaracterization of you. And you are right, at this point it’s way past being a peasant like a forum-goblin but upgraded to an lootgoblin!
I mean don’t get me wrong. I wouldn’t mind to get potentially more stashtabs… it’s just that i can see why some devs (like crate) want to heavily limit it, but if EHG want to go all out, i’m up for it. Especially due this is ‘kinda’ live-service with the cycles and stuff and will drop regularly new content, uniques and stuff, at one point even with 200 stashtabs they might want to expand it anyway (if technical possible). So yeah.
Yeah, exactly like this. Like gonna be honest with, i often feel pretty confident with my english-skills and such… thanks to the internet and videogames i’m pretty exposed to it, but stuff like this - especially if it comes down to the technical or more complex stuff it seems ESL and Language-Barrier still hits me. And i certainly see i could’ve phraed/explained it better.
With my ‘Solution’ i’d even go as far and argue/say, that it doesn’t really is an advantage over newcomers (because you mentioned equal start) - because it’s pretty much how you carry over your lootfilters as well. And if this QoL Feature gets added, they even could expand on it as an “Stashtab-Planner” or how i should call it, where you can create your “preview” (or if it’s copy/past / Clipboardable like the filters, i’m pretty sure thirdparty websites would do something like this). That way veterans can carry over their preview each season, while newcomers can take their time and plan out their sorting system. And again just to be clear you buy each stash piece-by-piece from the preview, a planner in that regard would also be just to create a preview not outright buy them.
I second this. Gold spent in cycle stashes should lead to the appropriate amount of stash tabs being added to the available legacy stash tabs or just refunded directly.
The worst case scenario of a new player with like 100 cycle stash tabs now having no usable legacy stash tabs is no bueno but it affects everyone who cares about legacy and didn’t have the max 200 yet
I really like both those ideas but they go beyond the simple correction that is needed now.
As is, players in this (my) position suffer massively from having picked the advertised default option cycle over just playing legacy on release.
Had I just done the same in legacy, I’d be sitting on 140+ paid off, neatly organized stash tabs ready to continue what I’ve built.
Now I shall pay off a second mortgage? Why?
I have said (in the other thread) I don’t want beyond 200 tabs or cheap tabs, only what I paid for. I had expected some formula like:
amount of legacy stash tabs = highest amount ever unlocked simultaneously. That way I don’t get cheaper tabs by adding tabs 1-20 every cycle and I also don’t exceed 200.
Going from 140 to none is pretty much game-breaking. Like I get thrown out of my house with all my belongings packed in plastic bags. That doesn’t count as continuing playing these characters. It is not at all comparable to merging 100 new tabs into 100 existing old tabs.
I completely agree. Even the analogies I’ve seen made to Path of Exile don’t stack up: in Path of Exile, you still get all of the stash tabs you paid for, you just also have the remove-only tabs from the previous season(s).
All players who purchased any stash tabs in Cycle are effectively being punished for believing that the work they put into grinding the necessary gold would be kept intact. This is even more egregious in cases such as your own where so many tabs were purchased.
To all those who don’t seem to think this is such a big deal: Would you be okay with a high-priced item you purchased via the Merchant’s Guild requiring you to pay its full cost once more to use it, once your character transitioned from Cycle to Legacy? Probably not, right? Because the gold that you spent on that item is a direct consequence of your time invested in the game. And requiring you to re-grind that gold is the same as deleting the hours of work it took to earn that gold in the first place. There is no fundamental difference between the gold you spent to purchase a Merchant’s Guild item and the gold you spent to purchase a stash tab. In both cases it is a currency earned by the player spending time in game.
So the developers need to properly honor the time players have spent in-game in all cases, not just arbitrary ones.
This is a humongous difference. It’s perfectly fine having to merge tabs 1-20 if I only ever get to 20 each cycle. But buying stash tabs beyond your legacy amount should be transferred.
I mean, this is blatantly obvious to me anyway. I can’t fathom a reason why having played cycle 1 instead of legacy would be supposed to bring this detriment.
From the way it looks ingame, I wonder if it were possible to “simply” let us allow which of the existing stashes we want to use as active stash. One-time choice obviously.
But if I could simply check a box to use my 1.0 stash as my new stash with all functionality, my issue would be solved. Any remaing stashes could become remove-only - even the new one. For surely people have filled this up at this point.
But I’d much rather have my old 140 tabs back at full functionality and a few remove-only from 1.1 than vice versa.
Sooooo… this time around, I was going to play on legacy since all the new features will be there as well as cycle. I logged in… figured out that my MANY cycle stash tabs were there but I would have to recreate EVERY SINGLE LIL TAB AND LABLE to Legacy…
heavy breathing
I closed the game. Logged in later and created a cycle character. I’d rather recreate everything from the ground up than go through the logistical HORROR I encountered on Legacy. I can’t even!
Totally agree +1 Dont want to have to refarm millions of gold to rebuy all stash tabs ive earned since release before can start Cycle. Given there was no difference in release cycle this just punishes new players
