I meant it spends small chunks at a time so my mana trickles down rather than being consumed fully in a few seconds. (I’m not running erasing strike with +mana cost)
Yes, I meant this along with possibly the affixes that do the same.
If you have Warpath specced to auto cast Smite though, there is almost no reason to not have Smite on your bar.
1 Like
Since I played the game. There were discussions back then why VK has no shield nodes and synergies and there it came up. Don’t ask me how far back this was but since then I haven’t heared any changes on the topic.
What the hell are you even talking about? Triggered cast of smite? What does that have to do with anything about recouping mana?
Your suggestion is that I should stop fighting mid combat to stop and ‘manually cast smite to get my mana back’ during combat? What kind of garbage clown builds are you playing that you think this would be a viable strategy? I’m supposed to give up an entire skill slot like anomaly (crit/leech scaling) or sigils (damage scaling) so that I can spec smite that serves no purpose but to regain mana? On a build that has almost zero cast speed, to stop mid combat and cast a bunch of smites to regain mana.
This is the dumbest suggestion I have ever heard, almost to the point that I thought you might actually be trolling or baiting me to respond to a rediculous suggestion to troll me. There are no builds that can ‘stop fighting’ at 600 waves in the arena or 600 corruption, mid combat and just start manually casting some smites to get mana back. You. Will. Die. Period.
My only idea is that you have to be some kind of casual player or new player who has only pushed to 150 corruption or 80 waves in the arena or something.
Thank the lord that someone like you isn’t in charge of balance decisions. The game would head directly into the toilet.
My mana bar is 120. I lunge 4 times at the start of a mono for 8 mana = 32 mana. I activate anomoly once for 20 mana to gain my crit / attack speed / leeh buffs = 32+20=52 mana. I fight for 30 seconds and lunge a few times, recast my anomoly once more to maintain my damage buffs. My mana bar is now gone and I’ve been in the monolith for only 35 seconds.
I’m doing something wrong? By using my abilities I’m doing something wrong? Lmao
Maybe the mana feels fine to you because you are playing 120 corruption where you never have an extended long fight with a large crowd of mobs that takes time to kill and have to use your abilities efficiently, or because you 1-shot everything at that corruption, or because you play the game on such a turtle pace that the time you spend slowly looting every garbage item and shard left on the ground that your mana bar has regen’d to full because you’re so slow at the game.
My “poor” play? Using my abilities and trying to maximize my combat efficiency is ‘poor play’? I’m literally forced into switching to a 2-handed weapon to enable efficient constant ability use/damage/buffs uptime, its a no-brainer I’m just going to do that and dual wield/1h shield players will simply do the same.
Apparently its ‘poor play’ yet I’ve literally pushed to rank 1 on the ladder / 700+ waves in arena on multiple builds, what have you done to be able to speak with so much authority about ‘poor play’ or ‘optimal builds’?
Except you don’t know what the hell you are talking about, because lizard literally pushed a dual wield void knight warpath build to almost 1k waves, IIRC he used a doom mace / katana. You just ‘assume’ that its the most optimal void warpath setup while disreguarding every void warpath setup that you don’t have knowledge of. You know what you are when you assume, an ass.
I’m actually considering taking an extended break from this forum entirely, not because I don’t like that people are disagreeing with me, but because people’s arguements and deliberation points are so weak that they’re not even worth responding to. I think the game is too early and still in a stage of infancy that we don’t actually have intelligent discussion on the forums, just the same group of casuals talking nonsense without any type of experience or meaningful knowledge reference points to draw on. Its not interesting or intellectually engaging, just boring and exhausting.
“Spam smite to regain your mana.” It has to be trolling. It has to be. There is no way this is a serious suggestion to every dual wield / 1h+shield warpath player.
The ENTIRE point of this thread is because YOU want to stop channeling to cast something else but don’t have infinite mana. You claim you run around doing nothing to just regen mana.
None of your arguments make sense anymore as you have just argued against yourself.
Wind’s of Justice node in Warpath along with specced Smite probably does more damage than Sigils. Sigils are hot garbage.
Finally something we agree on.
2 Likes
Winds of justice, a skill talent that requires almost 8 points to reach just so you can cast a smite every second while spinning in warpath. aha. hahaha. hahahahaah
Now I KNOW that you are a complete casual. Its not even worth responding to you. Yeah dude, winds of justice’s smite damage is hella sick. I’m sure your smite does incredible levels of damage without running weapons that have spell damage implicits on them. I don’t even main sentinel but I can see how bad these suggestions are.
Tell you what my man. In a few months when the ladder comes up and you see my name across the top 10 or top 1 of almost every arena ladder / corruption ladder / endgame ladder available, I want you to reach out to me again and talk to me once more about ‘poor play’ and ‘optimal builds’. I think the world of difference between our opinions on what is viable is because my endgame consists of pushing 1k corruption / 1k arena waves, and yours consists of dieing repeatedly to a 200 corruption orobus with one damage mod. We are not the same. For some reason, as it is in alot of things, it is the smartest people (not saying me, but people I know/speak/theorycraft with who don’t even post or interact with the normal social channels like this) who stay quiet, but people who have zero knowledge or results to show for it with the loudest voices. And its quite honestly not worth my time to argue with you any further. You are entitled to your opinion, thank you for your suggestion.
Adios.
Man, my ePeen suddenly feels incredibly small.
4 Likes
You know, someone told me that on reddit. They told me that the arena ladder is just an e-peen contest.
I told him that sounds like something that someone who couldn’t place on the ladder even if they tried would say.
Yes, you’ve created a build in a game where mana is a resource that doesn’t have a way to get back mana quickly. That’s your choice, but it’s not the game’s fault.
1 Like
Yes, I use my lunge regularly to move from pack to pack, and my anomoly to gain damage/leech/speed buffs. My reversal is free, and my sigils are not used (they are gained on kill). Yet, maintaining my damage buff and moving from pack to pack is enough to exhaust my mana without using any other skills, and this is arguably mandatory skill use. But its poor play to move and clear quickly. Warpath incentivises staying spinning for as long as you can, because every 2 seconds spent spinning has a chance to generate an echo. And this timer is restarted if I stop using warpath.
Yet I can do essentially exactly what I want to do if I change to a 2-handed weapon, and its essentially and fundamentally the most simple step to achieve a build that feels and plays great. So I drop dual wield or 1h / shield, and do it, just like every other player who stumbles into this inconvenience will do. And then later, we will not see very many dual wield or 1h/shield void warpath builds (infact most of them are already 2H for what I suspect is this reason).
The point is that Dark Nexus having this restriction serves no other purpose than removing a bunch of dual wield / sword and board warpath builds from the game, or at last limiting them so much that they have to play with zero-cost support skills only, therefore people won’t play them.
And because they are limited and fundamentally annoying/fustrating to play compared to the 2-handed variant, nobody will bother playing them, for no good reason. Less build diversity for no reason, in fact the 2-Handed void warpath variant is probably already stronger than dual wield/sword and board simply for the fact that the great itemization seen in the two handed axe Aparthy’s maw and all the leech rate gear that supports this archeotype already exists in the game.
Having no 2-h restriction on the node would simply enable warpath variants that were already typically weaker than the commonly played Apathy’s Maw variant (enabled out of convenience to play, not power, by the way) , but somehow people think that if those builds got 7 mana per 3 seconds, they would be ‘crazy overpowered,’ ‘game breaking’ or something.
I just can’t see it.
This is your problem. Whether you know it or not, the devs do not want “movement” skills to be used to speed through maps. That’s why they generally give them mana costs/cooldowns. You are complaining about something that was intentional to prevent people from “gotta go fast”.
This has actually been one of my complaints. VK gets so much love in uniques. I don’t think any other build in the game can go 100% uniques (not counting LP to force uniques that don’t fit otherwise).
1 Like
Hey folks, please keep it a civil discussion. Thanks.
1 Like
I think this discussion has lost the plot a bit.
This is strictly a numbers question. If I’m not mistaken warpath gains increased hit rate based on attack speed. You go from a 0.92 speed (two-handed axe) to around a 1.1 speed (dual swords.) This would increase the hit frequency of warpath (an effective increase in damage.) For the purposes here I’ll only talk about dual wield as 1h/shield is most likely strictly too strong to be included in this mana conversation.
Dual wielding already has it’s drawbacks with it’s 9% more damage taken modifier. So the question is do the additional affix modifiers and increased hit rate require consideration for allowing the Battlemaster’s Blade and Dark Nexus nodes to apply to dual wielding. With the current state of unique weapons for Void Knight and the paths in that tree I don’t see any significant game balance drawbacks for allowing those nodes to also apply to dual wielding.
It may be a decision on EHG’s side to prevent adding additional features to that node because they regret the capability that node brings to warpath in general, but that’s not the topic of discussion and not for any of us to really determine. I think the idea is perfectly fine and adds more build options for skills (which is what we all want.)
1 Like
It would be cooler if there was enough support for it in the skill tree
I guess it depends what you mean by "supports’. Only 3 nodes don’t have any support for dw/s&b out of 27.
Ow… there it is again, your arrogant attitude. Why do you even post on these forums when you don’t think anybody has the right to disagree with you? Isn’t there an elite group of pro players you can talk with instead of all these average Joes here?
hm…
3 Likes
This is how the game apparently is intended to be played by the developers in some situations, also heres 5x damage modifiers on your maps because its finely tuned and we want things to matter.
I love Cyclone/Whirlwind and every other iteration of spinning, except here I hated it. Infact theres so many awful interactions in this game you need to deal with its hard to find a build that doesnt grate you into the ground after a few days of playing
For spin2win in high content theres 2 things that are unacceptable:
- running out of mana
- getting stunned
Ive ran inefficient Cyclone builds in PoE that relied on constantly leeching to keep attacking as I reserved 90+% of my mana from Auras and you can Cyclone into a pack, miss the mob, run out of mana and get clapped as you just completely stop moving and eat damage. You have to fix it to be smoother but you have so many tools available: Mana regen/leech/higher mana pool/- cost of skills/% cost of skills etc. So many OPTIONS
I had to use Volatile Reversal to solve mana in LE, hated it.
Ive only rolled 3 builds since MP release and they all spend virtually no mana or have crazy sustain so its infinite so I dont have to ever worry about it and actually just enjoy using my skills.
For example Spriggan gets Rage Totems node, completely nullifying any reason for Quiet Forest belt to exist however Quiet Forest cannot keep up with the Rage costs of having 9 totems out, instead you sacrifice your healing from the totems, there isnt even an option here you HAVE to do this unless you wear potentially Eterra Boots/Rage amulet AND spec into Vines wasting more points - for 4 points I can remove Mana entirely from the game on that build.
There is, but I’m not sure he was chosen for it.
/irony
2 Likes
I think the devs should implement some restrictions on the forums. Maybe something like:
- You can only answer or quote on topics when you have a character with matching corruption level or arena rank (+/- 100 corruption or +/- 50 waves) compared to OP
- If one of the lowbobs creates a topic and a top 10 arena player disagrees, the topic should be immediately closed
- Every topic from a top 10 arena player gets automatically upvoted when anybody reads it and gets immediate dev staff attention (like an alarm bell ringing at Mike’s house so they can have an emergency meeting to discuss it) - the exception is when the topic is from a rank 1 player because then there doesn’t need to be a dev diacussion - suggestion get implemented right away
- When the top 10 players are devided on a topic the user with the highest rank decides the discussion
But this was just a sidenote.
Now on topic:
I don’t really like how the mana nodes are positioned in the tree. You loose a lot of damage if you invest in them. You need to max it out in order to have an impact and “loose” skillpoints. This might be intended as a tradeoff, but it has the effect that I always never use it.
I don’t see any issue if it would be changed to also work with DW or 1h/Shield (although I think you don’t want to go that route with 1h/shield as it is the lowest possible damage setup). The 2h nodes are from a time when DW got introduced and outperformed everything else. Back then there needed to be some ways to motivate people to play 2h as it was said to be in a bad spot.
From my experience DW has become less attractive to players for classes besides Rogue in general as it makes you take more damage. And on top the 2h players have the option to use a Titan Heart to even get an additional less damage taken multiplier.
So why not give DW some love and add the mana function. Just for fairness.
1 Like