PS5 & LE: Orobyss Follow-up From Judd

[BeardusMaximus]

I enjoyed this response

[Kahzimi]

This post was flagged by the community and is temporarily hidden.

[Kulze]

And this everyone is what’s called a financial doormat.

A person which doesn’t understand what a contract is and a person which is absolutely fine of their business partner goes back on their words.

I would even argue you’re the cause of the modern problems in gaming with your lack of understanding that it’s not about money (surely for some, but LE is not a overly expensive game) but about the principle of it.
Give a finger and they’ll take the whole arm off… and you’re even laughing while they do rip it off. That’s insanity and nothing else.

[ArcticPotato]

That is the thing brother. I like the game? Yes. Do I want it around? Yes. Did I do something about it? Yes I bought 3 supporter packs because I wanted to support the game. Also depends on how often they will make such expansions and depends on how many other promises will be ignored from EHG/Krafton.

And maybe another thing you forgot is that not everyone is as lucky like me and you to WASTE extra money on a video game no matter how much you enjoy it because at the end of the day it is a video game it does not feed anyone when you throw money at it except the devs. So you grow up ya 2.0 Randy Pitchford and realize that opening a menu and seeing 1000 different things and are all priced with real money aint ok for a video game and never will be no matter if its cosmetics or content.

I just hope there wont be a day in the future where I wish I would have spent money on stash tabs instead of the 10th expansion coming up.

[MrJane]

I would absolutely pay money for an expansion. Just make sure content matches price and I’m there for it.

[Llama8]

@Kahzimi

To the few on here who are obviously hot spotting off their neighbours WiFi because they can’t afford their own internet maybe you should probably consider getting a job.

povo kent.

I’m sure it’s not the first time your kids have gone without dinner for a week and the trailor has no power. You’ll be fine.

@Kulze

And this everyone is what’s called a financial doormat.

Because calling other people names is always a good sign that you’re grown up.

@Kulze

person which doesn’t understand what a contract i

While I don’t consider it a contract given the fluffy wording, I honestly don’t know if I’ll get it given they have said several times that they won’t charge for content & that matters to me.

@Kulze

it’s not about money (surely for some, but LE is not a overly expensive game) but about the principle of it.

Yeah. How many other “nevers” are going to be changed to “well ackshually”?

[Houlala]

@Chomp96

I don’t even know why people act like that for the possibility of paying an expansion, probably all these people don’t have a job and don’t know how the world work.

And yet many tried to explain…
“People” is a wide term, we are all different. The main arguments I have seen: For many, the problem is that promises were repeated for years that there would be no paid expansions. For others like me, the core issue is that the base game was left badly unfinished. For some, maybe (although noone has posted that), it is about money.
Alexandra already expressed perfectly what I feel:

@Alexandra

What I’m baffled by is the story hasn’t even been completed to my knowledge, and now your asking us to PAY for an expansion. Talk about putting the cart before the horse!! I had high hopes for the game, but when it came to 1.0 with an unfinished story, I pretty much gave up. I Do love the combat and the way it played when I last touched it. But I’m not someone who will just let an unfinished Story slide as it keeps getting pushed back for further multiplayer reasons.

Finish your planned story arc and then I’ll consider paying for more.

Calling it “released” in 1.0 with an unfinished story was already a huge kick in the teeth. Simply pathetic.
I love expansions, and when I play a game I buy all expansions. Because they EXPAND on the lore, bring new story arcs and zones to visit.
Working on an expansion BEFORE you have something solid to expand on is preposterous. It could be £1, I wouldn’t buy it until the story is finished in a satisfying manner.

As for how the world works, you’re absolutely right, I don’t really know. Something about atoms coming together in extremely complex patterns, with an array of forces acting on them to create life? Kulze would know, he might explain it in a 80.000 words post someday…

[Kahzimi]

Hahah touched a nerve when I mentioned kids not eating?

Sorry for having a good job and making enough money to afford a video game and expansions lol. Played WoW for I dunno how many years paying XX dollars per month, most of those months no expansions just paying to play. I’d do that for LE as well. It’s fucking aces. Since starting LE back in March I’ve seen you sit on these forums day in and day out whinging about everything. You’re really sad and I’m suprised your trailor gets internet but hey, cry all you want my poor little buddy it doesn’t bother me one bit. People like you aren’t going to be missed. Have a nice evening lmaaaaaaao

If you guys don’t want to pay for anything just go find a free to play game, plenty out there. Whinging on the forums isn’t going to help

[Kulze]

Sorry to say… but I’m actually - unlike 99% of people - privileged enough to be able to sit a lot of time at home because of what I’ve managed to set up for myself.

Unlike you I don’t need to shove acknowledgment of my wealth down other people’s throats… probably because I’m not insecure about it. I can afford my 2 hobbies, my home, my car and several subscriptions without needing to worry about the end of the month coming.

I also don’t need to attach my personal value to my income since I have other things going on for me in my life.

As for WoW… yeah, subscription model, all fine and dandy. I played Ultima Online, Tibia, Eve Online, Everquest, Everquest 2, WoW, OSRS… all of em are subscription models. So?
What’s your point?

I would’ve been fine if EHG decided from the start to use a subscription model rather then the shelf-price + MTX one, all fine. Nothing against that.
But… they didn’t.
I went into the product with the premise of it not being that case and hence I won’t accept them moving over to such a model as it’s not what I paid for.

@Llama8

Because calling other people names is always a good sign that you’re grown up.

Fair… but what else would you call it?
A person which lets someone else literally scam them and defending it? That’s kinda odd, isn’t it?
What terminology would you use for someone like that? I think ‘financial doormat’ fits relatively fine without being actually insulting.

And the condescending tone is after all deserved, isn’t it? Attacking everyone for having a different opinion, insulting them and talking down on them is kinda a direct ask to not be taken seriously. We all fall into something of that sort at times… but those posts clearly are faaaar beyond the limit of acceptable I would argue.

[Llama8]

@Kahzimi

Sorry for having a good job and making enough money to afford a video game and expansions lol.

If you’re going to brag about having a good job, would you mind learning how to spell?

Many of us have a “good job” & can afford it we just may not want for other reasons, some of which Houlala pointed out.

[Kahzimi]

This post was flagged by the community and is temporarily hidden.

[HorusKBZ]

@Kulze

I went into the product with the premise of it not being that case and hence I won’t accept them moving over to such a model as it’s not what I paid for.

If they had written in the kickstarter:

The planned pay method is x$ box price, mainly to deter bot and spam accounts. We intend to finance our service and continued development purely by selling cosmetic MTX, with future content updates being free. If revenue from cosmetics doesn’t suffice to run operations without a loss, we might have to change plans.

Would this change things?

[CaiusMartius]

Plus, there have been numerous other instances, including release notes, where they’ve said things like “our current plan” or some variation on that.

It’s been 8 years. No business maintains the exact same model that started with 8 years prior. They adapt to changing needs, ffs remember ‘we aren’t going to allow people to change masteries, though we never say never.’

Time and again they have emphasized the lack of anything being entirely immutable. People are very selective about what they choose to remember.

I, for one, have been here since virtually the beginning (I missed the Kickstarter by three weeks, which still chafes my neck meat. :D) They’ve always been about as transparent as any company can be. They’ve made mistakes (mac user here) and owned up to them. They’ve demonstrated time and time again how much they listen, how much they’re geeks at heart, how much they love the genre and the community.

If none of these earn them the respect of at least “Skeptical but I’ll wait and see how it plays out” then nothing ever will.

[Kulze]

@HorusKBZ

Would this change things?

Absolutely!

@CaiusMartius

If none of these earn them the respect of at least “Skeptical but I’ll wait and see how it plays out” then nothing ever will.

Yeah, always be ‘skeptical but waiting’ overall.
Doesn’t mean you cannot talk about the negative potential aspects now, can you?
‘Being prepared is half the battle’ after all.

If it doesn’t happen? Great! Lenience is there.
If it happens? Well, whatever action people want to take simply. Be it just stopping the payments, stopping engagement entirely or actively going out of their way to stand up for what they perceive is their rights. Whatever it is… you can plan for it beforehand after all.

[HorusKBZ]

I feel like some people see a slightly ambiguous wording (while I think the intent that the business model can change if it doesn’t work out is there) use this to construct a Gotcha! moment to have unreasonable (my opinion) expectations.

Now, if I were EHG, I would give original backers and those who bought supporter packs with a combined value of $xx expansions for free unless the scope of the expansion is massive, basically creating a new game. But those like me, who only bought the base game? Yeah, charge money from me.

I never buy cosmetics (unless I get points for free, like in SWTOR as part of my subscription, back in the day). I hate supporter packs that include time-limited offers because it creates FOMO in many a customer, leading to people overspending more than is reasonable for them.

My favourite model is paid expansions. It’s in my opinion the most honest business model. They put in work, I pay them for it once and have access to it in the future thanks to full-offline mode.

@Kulze

Yeah, always be ‘skeptical but waiting’ overall.
Doesn’t mean you cannot talk about the negative potential aspects now, can you?

Yep, it’s a fun little exercise, and educating, since our discussions are usually free of ad hominem attacks, which is quite a rare treat on the internet.