I’ve played Lost Ark so I know exactly what you mean about raids, gatekeeping and the whole works (one of the many reasons I quit).
And I’ve had the reverse experience in Path of Exile where the issue isn’t the fight but the entry barrier. The problem there is it literally takes consumption of currency to even reach the fight i.e. Maven, Sirus and if you fail, that’s it, you now need to wait for a good portion of time before you can even reattempt the fight at all since you’re dependent on external items. Even with studying youtube videos, it’s still really difficult (my first maven attempt was a total flop, Sirus is still nuts) and I’ve had to give up entirely on those.
Like you said though, a week isn’t that long. It is a little annoying, but probably won’t be a big deal. Realistically I’ll probably be leveling my character in cycle anyway.
I’ll have to wait till July to see how you access pinnacle content, that’s definitely going to be interesting to see.
No, it isn’t. None of what you listed qualifies as features or functionality, including and especially the last two points which are just dishonest versions of the same point - “You can cheat”. You’re just grasping at straws because you don’t want to accept that by choosing to play offline, not only will you forever matter less, but it’s not wrong that you do either.
I’m not that’s correct, I get the feeling that the offline client is an important thing to them, just like some form of trade or skill trees.
That’s going too far.
But this is, sadly, true and too big of an ask for some.
You are confusing online legacy (where all my characters are) to offline. There’s no offline ladder because nothing can be verified, as you say, but online legacy characters only exist on EHG’s servers as much as online legacy. If online legacy can’t be verified then neither can online season.
For 2 reasons, 1 pertaining to offline (they don’t want hacked characters with 1.6 billion hp to kill the bosses moments after they are released & spoiling the fights for everyone else) & 1 pertaining to online legacy (they don’t want high level BiS geared characters to be killing the bosses moments after they’ve been released & spoiling the fights for everyone else).
Apart from the person doing it.
And that is a very different & fair kettle of fish.
Sorry, no lag is not a feature? Dude, you smoking something or have you just painted yourself into a corner & can’t accept that sometimes “the other side” can have valid points? Even I can do that (sometimes, it’s a work in progress) & I’m probably borderline autistic.
Just saying, Point 4. and 5. are against ToS, even on the offline client.
When buying a game you agreed to a contract that even applies to this offline client.
EHG generally is pretty lenient with this, as its very difficult to prove people breaching this and usually it doesn’t have a great effect.
But techically speaking you just confessed a breach of ToS in your Point No. 4
All of your points are also not features and just advantages due to technical reasons.
Yeah not so much. Support was advised I would be making modifications to my save folder, backing it up, deleting files and restoring them during troubleshooting and remediation. They raised no concerns regarding TOS violations and just told me to let them know how it went. Working to fix a bug is not a violation of the TOS, and if it is, that’s a problem with the TOS, not the actions in question.
As to the rest of it, the guy testing the builds or offline mods in general, well, I’ll let the devs speak for themselves:
And you think that them monitoring your pc to check what you’re doing with the fully offline client may not potentially breach data protection or privacy laws? And even if it doesn’t (I have no idea, not a lawyer), it’s, IMO, a masdive moral breach.
Well backing up, copying and/or renaming files is not really “modifying” files.
Also if you do it togehter with the official EHG support its a whole other story.
And as I said EHG is very lenient with it anyway.
What you describe now is also somethign very different from other stuff you could do by tinkering with the save files.
Still modifying files would be against ToS and you could expect EHG to take actions against people doing so.
Restrictions and Limitations.
Eleventh Hour Games may suspend or revoke the License, or parts, components, and/or single features thereof, if You violate, or assist others in violating, the license limitations set for under these Terms of Use. You agree that You will not, in whole, in part, or under any circumstances, do the following: […] (ii) modify or adapt (including through third parties and third party tools) the game client or its data, other than in the normal course of Last Epoch gameplay as permitted in accordance with the License; […]
The quote you posted from Sarno is over 4 years old and does very likely not reflect their current stance on such things anymore.
This is the data which is most readily available when searching for their position on mods; if you have something which is actually more recent and which is reflective of a different stance, you’re welcome to share it. Until then, it’s odd to complain about the age of something and then reference something even older to support your argument, given that typically agreements can be superceded by subsequent mutual agreement between parties.
And yeah, backing up your saves, deleting them, renaming them, and otherwise taking actions to correct file corruption is fundamentally different from modifying the contents of the game files to replace visual effects or otherwise mod the game, or from modifying the contents of your save files to edit the items, stats, or characteristics contained within. That’s why it’s two different items.
I’m sure it is and/or started out that way - They wouldn’t have done it otherwise. But the benefit to them is going to be marginal and the amount of time and effort it takes to continue delivering, no matter how good they are, is going to be considerable. I feel confident in saying that it will be, if it isn’t already, an ongoing source of the word “god damnit” passing their lips.
Arguably, but it’s not wrong.
Nope. Just like @Heavy said - Benefit, yes. But absolutely not something I would call an actual feature.
My only concern is that offline ppl will, let us say, hex edit for old times sake, their way into pinnacle boss victory. I think seeing live / online footage will be a lot more healthy for the game.
The entire point which you seem to miss is that the Dev in question would have made that statement after the TOS is already in place. Meaning they are theoretically aware of it, and are making the statement anyway. At minimum, this is a tacit endorsement of behavior, and at most, it represents a modification to the previous agreement, if agreed to mutually.
All contracts (including EULAs) are subject to mutual agreement modifications, whether written, verbal, or otherwise, outside of specific clauses exempting such modifications, which are not present in the EULA in question. You say “a written down ToS on a official platform is definitely better than a comment of a dev in a forum” but legally it doesn’t matter whether something is a comment on a phone call, a handshake agreement, something written on a napkin and signed, a forum post, or a formal contract. Mutual agreement from all parties is what is required for modifications of an agreement, that’s it. The only question is whether or not the Dev in question has the legal authority to represent EHG with their statements, which fundamentally I don’t know, but it doesn’t really matter.
It REALLY doesn’t matter. After all, the entire point of the ToS is to define what they do and do not consider acceptable behavior and protect themselves in the event legal action is necessary or undertaken, by either party. But remember, the clauses in the ToS allow them to cancel your member account, and terminate your access to the materials or services, at any time, without notice to you, and for any reason whatsoever. Violation of the ToS is not required. They can choose to kill your account because you violated the ToS, they can choose to kill it because they just don’t like you. It does not matter whether or not modifying your local data during offline play is actually a violation of ToS for any reason whatsoever, outside of legal action between someone and EHG, at which point it would be a matter for the lawyers to figure out.
At the end of the day, it’s not about what is in the ToS. It’s about what EHG does and does not consider acceptable, and thus when they are likely to take enforcement actions on their side. Technically having a buddy over and letting them touch your mouse and keyboard and try out a character is a violation of the ToS, you know. But the likelihood is that the concerns EHG has in regards to other entities accessing your account are related to legal liability and account sales, and they’re not going to permaban you for letting someone try out a character for 5 minutes. Given that all enforcement actions are at their sole discretion and for any reason whatsoever, that’s what matters. Not what is and isn’t legally binding within the ToS, but what they’re going to do in the event of a given course of action.
And, unless the devs are lying regarding being totally ok with offline mods, I think that’s been made pretty clear.
Yes but there is a reason ToS often times wont stand up in court for many reasons(Not that this ToS would fail to protect them)
But reality is, ToS is almost always simply made as tight as possible just for a “incase” situation.
There is so much shit that is against ToS on so much software/programs that everyone and their mom ignores.
I honestly wouldnt take any ToS seriously especially when it comes to an offline product. ToS is just a good way for companies to be like “think twice about doing this” Which tbh many people do think twice. And continue anyways, and EHG goes “Very good, this case is okay we will be fine” or “No, thats not okay, we are not fine we will now enforce the ToS and revoke your access to the service”
This comment section is absolutely wild LMAO.
The sense of entitlement is way too high.
Theres obviously going to be a race, and they obviously want it to be fair.
It’s only a week at maximum. You’re still getting content updates for your “offline” mode for a game you already paid for. Be thankful!
So wait your turn and then you can kill the boss on whatever babymode you play on!
In the third chart you present the only # rounded to 0 decimals in the entire presentation as the final choice, but the pie chart doesn’t foot. 39+38.9+22.2 = 100.1%. That 39% is actually a 38.9%, you rounded for presentation. At least make the chart foot if you’re going to try and manipulate the visuals. Rookie move.
All this discussion show only one thing, despite the vote are 70% favorable to the delay, in this comment section seems that the result are reversed at least, with almost everyone complain for that, it’s really true that the silent majority isn’t loud, and that the minority keeps jelling, I hope the devs know that and can make in the future the right decisions not being disguised by these people, or at least continue with this survey
I guess you didn’t look at the numbers in the survey then if you think that ~30 odd people are the “quiet majority” while 5-10k are the “vocal minority”.
Thankful for what? Giving me what I paid for? EHG is a company and a company tries to make as much money as possible and that is the #1 primary goal of a company, money. Yes, you are indeed very much entitled to receive what you spent money on, that is how the world works, that’s called a “service”, you give money and then you receive service.
Entitlement is not a negative thing and the silver bullet against every argument, because you are entitled to many things
While EHG does want to make money and grow, this is not their primary goal.
If that would have been the primary goal they would have done many many decisions in the past very differently.
Their primary goal always was to deliver the best arpg possible.
EHG has made many decisions based on community feedback.
Some decisions however they also did despite community feedback.
But regardless if you are a longtime follower of the game or relatively new.
I don’t know how one could think that EHG is giving you the feeling to make the most money possible.
They waited years until they released their MTX shop. It was released in the last update before 1.0 (0.9.2) in a very minimal version to receive feedback.
They received feedback and adjusted. Now they are slowly rolling out more things.
If they would want to make as much moeny as possible they would have released MTX for as muc hthigns as possible as fast as possible. Which they didn’t.
They would never made so good looking 3D models, to incentivice MTX purchases.
They would not implement transmogrification as a baseline feature and would put it behind MTX.
