Maybe they deleted the thread & then thought “hold my beer”.
1 Like
For me it is this. I was about to buy a Supporter Pack for this season when all the issues started.
Paid classes don’t equal P2W even if they are balanced to be strongest. The only real competitive portion of the game is the ladders and they are sorted by class. Plus there will always be multiple S-Tier classes, most of which won’t be paid.
Full P2W ARPGs are Undecember and Torchlight Infinite. Lost Ark is very P2W but you could get very strong if you were willing to grind tons of alts for mats for your main.
I thought ladder was just any and all classes? I mean it doesn’t matter either way, it’s not like ladder gets you unique rewards so the argument stands that you aren’t “winning”.
I’d still consider it a problem, maybe related, if they focused on only the new classes and left the current ones in disrepair. Hoping that’s not the case, a lot can happen in a year.
We got a market.
A market is a natural and inherent competitive environment.
So no, the ladder is not the only aspect.
Also it’s for any non-official competitive aspect, be it in a friend-group, any private event like a race or such and so on. Those also fall in the category.
Also ladders are not class-specific alone. For example the arena ladder is universal, it shows the class but doesn’t enforce discernment by class… hence that’s why the 5 people still vying for it complain so much there.
3 Likes
They were always trying to paint this picture of “regular guys from reddit just making a game”.
Also, the whole issue isn’t even about what promises they made - it’s about the game model. If it was something like “we will have 30 classes by launch” it would be a bummer but that’s all. When you decide to lock a class behind a paywall, you betray the trust of all the people who supported you only because they knew (or hoped) the power won’t be dependent on a bank account balance.
To be fair, that was how they started out & I wonder how much that apparent lack of experience is the root of their problems.
First off: New Class that will be premium doesn’t necessarily mean power.
Secondly, if they would have done paid expansion but free class, that could have been “pay to win” as well, because if the new expansion has new items, that enable builds, make build stronger, having better farming spots, better endgame modes for more efficient grinding etc.
Overall the decision to make a paid class instead of a paid extension is a brave one, but one that I personally see could turn out better, if they get the balance right.
We also have to really think about what exactly they said. It doesn’t sound like it will just be a regular class, it is called paradox class for a reason.
We need more details, which will come before the classes release I am sure, because when they will be premium EHG will have to give us a lot of details what exactly these class will entail.
In the meantime we will at least have 2 more regular seasons with new patches and content, so lets see how far LE will go in this timeframe before we even get to the paid content.
I would say ‘The majority’ even.
They are gamers and not businessman inherently. Stumbled upon getting known, the product got hyped up beyond measure and they failed to follow the most basic ‘Make money 101’ rules to make use of their extreme success.
Only if it’s not a distinct community split… hence non-expansion player and expansion player being put into the same environment.
If it’s different environments then there is no competitive factor available.
As long as people without the class and people with the class aren’t put into separate areas they are competing in the same environment, which is the problem.
Some people may not care about class specific ladders, but they are definitely never going to be balanced and so leaderboards only make sense per class, and honestly per mastery.
To be P2W the paid class would need to be noticeably stronger than all free ones. Considering how unbalanced builds are I don’t expect that to happen. But I do expect them to have builds that are S-Tier for say farming uber
1 Like
Okay, free expansion is good news.
Paid class not so much, but I get why you are doing this. As a customer I’m still miffed about it. Not so much as most people in this thread, but it still sours what LE currently is (and will be).
What irks me most is the roadmap though. For how long you have taken to show it, it offers insultingly little.
I don’t know why you stopped actually talking to us, but please stop the pr talk. Everyone is sick of it and it does nothing to garner you any favours. It just fans the flames even more.
I would suggest you take a good look at 3 games and their history.
-
Obviously PoE. Mostly for how they make and set up their microtransactions, including sales. You have a very ethical approach with your shop. Keep it but make it better.
-
Grim Dawn for communication especially concerning their expansion. They had a massive delay, but everything was fine because they were open about it and earned enough trust beforehand. Almost everyone is still hyped. For months now they do a monthly update and reveal a little bit about what they are working on. Just steady, good and open communication with devs (mostly a single dev) answering some questions. The GD crew always had a firm “it’s done when it’s done” stance even if it meant delays. But they followed through. And that works very well for them.
-
Guild Wars 2 for their struggles, failings and successes with their buisness model, how they set up their expansions and their “seasons” (Living World it’s called there). I know it’s a different genre, different playerbase with different expectations and all, but they had the same starting point as LE and the game is becomming more and more popular currently. Base Game was buy to play without monthly abo. Then they released paid expansions. Seasons were content between expansions and they were free as long as you were actively playing during their launch and paid after. At some point the base game became free (as did the first season I think) and older expansions were bundled together and got a price cut.
That said every GW2 “season” was a massive content update. A single Living World Episode offered around 15h story content + whatever amount of time you would want to invest to farm special currency for special rewards. Some had more stuff to do some less. They also had a relatively slow release schedule (another parallel to LE). This means it all comes down to “content”. You have to deal with the PoE curse (they are churning out good content like there is now tommorow) and everything you do will be measured against it. But if you can make players go “wow” with content, they are probably fine with paying.
Unfortunately you talked yourself in a corner with all the “always free” talk you did before and as we all know the internet does not forget. That is done so the only way forward is to rectify the way you do your communications, follow through with content, improve your MTX and earn back trust while avoiding building a p2w image. You are probably forced to make some p2w aspects (like the paradox classes… which are a very slippery slope in that regard at best) but you absolutely need to overshadow them with content. Content is king.
The GW2 shop is also a good thing to take a look at. All in all the shop is not hated even though it has p2w elements, lootbox garbage, etc.
I really hope you guys find a good way forward. I still like the game and I hope it stays that way.
3 Likes
I starting to feel you guys would rather saw EGH go bankrupt and LE die, just don’t change their original monetisation. Also I habent sawnso many smart a$$es crying about their otiginal monetisation plan, like “No don’t do that! Don’t try to rely on the community to sustain your ever growing needs of developing a live service game! It will bite you in the a$$! NOOOOOOOO!!!” Also also, I know, because I’m part of gameing forums for a long time now, and for you Karens it does not matter what would be in a DLC, you would be doing this swan song, like the wold is about to end, like EHG is intentionally kicked your puppy to death. Is it realy that hard to understand that the situation and circumstances has changed, they needed to adapt, and there is nothig wrong with that, and just grow the F… up?
2 Likes
Oh, there’s all sorts of things wrong with that.
EHG had 250k users during 1.0… and wasn’t profitable.
They had 70k in 1.1… not profitable.
They had 150k in 1.2… not profitable.
And 80k in 1.3… not profitable.
It’s not that their initial monetization idea wouldn’t have worked.
It’s that they didn’t do shit to actually provide any monetization, then didn’t act when it showed they couldn’t sustain themselves and that going on until shit hit the fan and we get stuff specifically promised to not happen as a result.
Could’ve provided MTX sooner.
Could’ve informed us sooner.
Could’ve asked us for things we wanna buy sooner.
But instead the were incompetent beyond end and drove a friggin goldmine into the ground.
2 Likes
They had the chance, they had the time, they had the fan base, they had the money but in the end, they didn’t do shjt and cashed out with milions 
That so called Road Map is a total disgrace to the community, those who did believe in EHG.
How couldn’t some of you see it? They deserved for what they did.
Dread’s video pretty much represent our feelings towards EHG. We love the game but all the action after action that EHG did to the game is just such a disappointment to the fans 
1 Like
LE had such potential but with time, it’s clear it never had a solid plan to execute. Such a shame cause it was fun at first but this just proves how it’s headed the wrong direction with no actual dates and keeping everyone waiting for any new actual information and then to top it off with locking a new class behind a paywall…yeah you guys are being cancelled fast. I’ll keep playing other games.
Another game destroyed by Krafton,
Honestly the whole 20npc for market is the worst trading system out of all games that exist currently on the market.
Custom spell effects looks like they are made by 10 years old, that is why no one buys them, they are horrible, portals are nice, but literally worse than default, cause u cant see colour change on completed monolith, its almost like PAY to loose.
Now making pay character that is probably going to be 3x stronger than everything else in the game, essentially making game pay to win.
6 months long season no one plays on top of that, I mean unless next season isnt GIGA fun, game will be dead within a year, nothing can save it anymore if next 2 seasons are as garbage as last one…
What a sad ending for a game that had potentional
1 Like
I don’t mind some of the skill skins, but $5 to $15 per? Not for me 
If they were class bundled for $10, maybe. If they added more that reflected the season as bundles, maybe.
where is the roadmap? IT SHOWS NOTHING< ARE U DUMB?
2 pictures that say season 4 and exp, with NO INFORMATION…how is this a roadmap, where is the actual info of dates, prices, features or anything???
1 Like
True, but do you honestly believe that EHG are capable of balancing a new class/mastery in line with all the others? How balanced have all the reworked masteries been when they were released compared to the others? How balanced were the Falconer & Warlock masteries when they released? What makes you think that now EHG have suddenly become capable of creating balanced classes?
I personally don’t believe that they’d make a class OP just to sell it, though I get why someone would, I just don’t think that “malice” (deliberately making it OP so it sells well then nerfing it later) is distinguishable from “incompetence”.
You know that can’t be the case given Heavy’s comment. It’s almost like you deliberately misread the comment.
Given Kulze’s comments here, the “amount” of imbalance is irrelevant, he’s just talking about the principle. 
Some people would certainly cut their nose off to spite their face.
It wasn’t destroyed by Krafton, it’s been on it’s unfortunate path for quite a while.
So you’re telling me that if the fix the problems that have been mass reported by people for YEARS that they never fixed and then made good looking MTXs you would quit the game? So what you want the game even more broken? Do you want the game to be PoE?
If this is what makes you quit the game then the problem is that you never wanted to play LE in the first place.
There are 2 things needed for making MTX a reliable form of income. The first is the game needs to be good enough to have people playing it a lot. In it’s current state it’s practically dead after a week. The second is having good looking MTX. People will not buy your MTX if they think they are ugly but in order for them to want to buy even beautiful MTX you have to first give them a reason to play the game so they can get their money’s worth out of the MTX, after all, no one will buy it to play for a week every 4 months.
Now yes, BP can be bad but you can go the helldiver 2 direction as well. You buy a BP and you have forever to finish it. The BP also doesn’t goes away, anyone can buy any BP. You can easily remove FOMO, most don’t because it’s more profitable that way but you can do that and helldivers 2 proved it’s possible and profitable.
4 Likes