I enjoy conversation with you. I’d rather someone have good reasons for their position and try to understand each other than this lame nonsense of trying to make it personal and then attacking someone on that basis.
Looks like you’re the one who’s wrong and should remain in silence if you can’t understand this point. You want to be rude, I can definitely reciprocate. How about we not?
Being pedantic is fine. If you’re correct to begin with.
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(If possible) I think being the case as it is, why not someone devs or not, make a mega thread about MP and pin it up, since people keep making a thread about this every few months from what people seems to allude.
Make it about what we know so far about the MP, don’t add speculations (this is debatable) since IMO, it can ruin the MP because of what people expect. If anyone make subsequent post about MP after the creation of said mega thread, it will be close and redirected to that thread instead.
Having a dev create/pin a topic about release timing would be fine, imo, but I think threads discussing implementation shouldn’t be closed/redirected to some megathread. That practice in general is taken as silencing behavior, so it really should be reserved for very select things.
I think most of us agree that it’s annoying to see “When is multiplayer?” constantly when the answer is, “When it’s ready.”
What if it just an automatic notification that state: you can always post this into the megathread if closing the thread is too much?
Also, what i meant was that he/she can post whatever his/her post on said megathread without it being censor whatsoever, it just kind of an announcement that said thread is better posted on megathread.
Yes it’s pretty much kinda annoying isn’t it?
I’ve seen shady dev teams / PR managers use megathreads to try to manipulate public perception and effectively silence voices by burying those voices under the tombstone of a “megathread” on several occasions. It’s a really bad look for EHG if they go that route in any enforceable manner. If the megathread is simply a suggestion, but leaves players free to create their own threads on the topic, I doubt it would be a big deal.
I’ve seen that as a discussion point against megathreads before, but in all honesty most of the time it’s bullocks imo. If the same question is being asked over and over again, and most of the time the answer remains the same, a megathread condenses all conversation around said topic in one place making it easier for devs (and anyone else interested in following the discussion) to keep track of what people are saying. There’s no need to have 14 threads asking the same thing spread months apart with dozens of posts each when a single megathread can serve as a reference for every bit of the conversation.
I can’t speak for anyone else, but my reading experience is far more pleasant that way.
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The problem with megathreads is that it’s not really reasonable to expect someone to read through the entire discussion once the thread has grown long enough. It works great for those who were incrementally following along, but it’s just too much for someone who hasn’t. This discourages people from both reading and posting on the topic and is why it is seen as silencing behavior when it is used to prohibit new topics.
I’ve seen it first hand on several occasions (DDO, SW:TOR, across several EA and Ubisoft titles, etc). While I don’t consider EHG to be the kind of company to deliberately use them in this way, it still gives off that perception–especially for those less familiar with what the company is about. It’s better to err on the side of retaining your reputation for open communication with the players and not as even perceivably manipulative/controlling/silencing.
One other problem with megathreads is that of definition. If you’re going to say, “All the MP stuff goes here,” where do you draw that line? If someone wants to talk about the networking infrastructure or logistics of the system, it’s a whole different conversation from trade, which is different from party compositions/strategy, etc. It’s just too stifling.
TLDR - it depends.
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Essentially, but with extreme caution. If it was just for “When will MP come out” and not general MP discussion, I think it’s appropriate. Keep the scope of such a megathread as narrow as possible and only for the most commonly repeated questions. For that matter, a pinned FAQ is probably a lot more appropriate. That way players can just direct newer users to that before having to spam the forum with copy/paste of the same thing asked different ways–and there’s a chance the newer players might check that out first anyway.
I agree, you have a fair point. Especially after showing the trailer MP is coming its odd that it is silence for so long now.
I still stick with my point however that MP should come when the base game is stable enough. In my opinion its not stable enough performance wise.
Also the game itself is still missing a lot of things like 3d art being 1 example of the many.
I think that when they update the artworks and more items (so your character actually looks great with every gear piece) the game might have even more stabillity problems.
I rather have a good working MP then a laggy one. It doesnt need to be perfect either in my opinion from the get go. With way more players on the servers you will probably face new problems which they can fix. They can’t do that right now i believe with way less people testing (i suspect community testers are testing it aswell but iam not sure about that ( i hope so).
The communication about multiplayer is bad at the moment imo.
Like you said its silent for to long.
I agree on that one. So i hope they’ll come up with some news.
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i cannot agree with you about this issue because game is not ready for it. thera are performance issues like when I explode 10 shadows in once with rogue, performance gets bad for couple of seconds. think that 3 people spamming skills with high screen density. it just cannot for now. Btw these are happening on geforce 1080c rtx(Tesla p40) card. Or there is other accesibility issues like unclear visuals. I think an arpg game needs these features before they get released. an arpg can be played alone but is hard to continue with bad accesibility features. They need to straighten up the design philosophy and engineering so in the future when they are changing or adapting things it would be easier to develop in general. First those and then MP imo
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Is it any more reasonable to expect people to read dozens of different threads to get the same amount of info?
If you want to peruse or leave feedback, it is easier for everyone involved to do so in a single location. Most issues players face are not unique, so there is no reason to have easily answered questions spread out over several discussions that may be missed by the devs or anyone interested in following along when they can all be piled in one place while more nuanced reports can be dealt with individually.
I get that this is off topic for the thread, but nothing kills the flow and usefulness of a discussion board like being spammed repeatedly with the same easily answerable questions. A megathread is a useful tool to mitigate that, and there isn’t any reason it should be avoided because the 1000th iteration of the same question isn’t deemed worthy of being it’s own thread.
/rant over
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It actually is due to how human nature and forums work. It’s not “ideal,” but it’s reality.
I already laid out several reasons.
This is why a FAQ is more appropriate.
It would be nice if people did a quick search before asking questions, even if they didn’t use the correct search terms at least they would have tried.
A FAQ would probably be a good idea, but that still relies on people reading first then asking questions later.
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Well, if they aren’t going to check/read a FAQ first, I don’t think a megathread would make sense either, lol
Let them first improve the optimisation, because it is tragic.
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Thanks (for the most part) for all the great discussion!! I think it’s healthy and interesting. Personally, I’m not here to try to pressure the devs to release something they don’t feel is ready, or to force them to divulge information. What I am here for is to try to help/encourage them on the best path forward to deliver the best game in the long run.
I have no idea what their resource allocation is like, but if I’m choosing between a programmer making the map function better or changing the passive tree from vertical to horizontal (?) vs. optimizations for MP, I’m gonna focus on the MP. To me it’s a much much more critical function that will further affect multiple other parts of the game.
As others have said, all sorts of things will naturally be forced to change once MP is in the picture, which means work/resources are being used to fine tune things that are more than likely going to have to be refined again.
The “when it’s ready” argument is not satisfying to me, because many issues will simply not present themselves until the game is in wide(r) release. A good example: look at chat. BTW one could argue that chat is already a big piece of MP, and it’s been a part of the game for a long time; no one seems to have minded that it wasn’t perfect when it was first available… And note it still has issues come up from time to time, even in this latest patch.
One thing that these discussions should also include is the multiple facets of MP. I think some people are only thinking about the MP core gameplay, and so naturally their biggest concern is always graphics optimization, etc. But that’s just one part. Class synergies, grouping logistics (with friends and/or strangers), database structure, trading, economy, server loads, cheat prevention… I’m sure there’s a lot more I haven’t thought of. I wonder if it wouldn’t be beneficial strategically to release some of these in pieces to lessen the pressure of getting everything right on a single MP patch. For instance… just introduce private group chat, or a persistent database for items, or… trading!
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The horizontal thing i get it. But are you being serious about the rest?
Did you realize the whole endgame system changed? Is that something they shouldnt had done aswell despite many people not liking it? Then they would have add multiplayer but nobody wants to play it because 1: the endgame system is not fun and 2: the performance on multiplayer is even worse.
They also tried to optimize the game. I think that should be done before MP dont you think?
I think some points are fair that you make but it feels like on other parts that you just want MP for the sake of it being multiplayer despite the performance being bad.
Even the video that they promoted showed that it wasnt all that smooth. I saw stutters there. Is it strange for a company to want to iron those kind of things out first?
It feels like you being unreasonable with some of your statements, but maybe thats just me.
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