it is almost impossible to balance all of the variables (as seen with all ARPGs on the market). Because, well, we want the complexity (and moooooore content, each week, weach month,!!! ), so do the devs.
There has to be a build or builds that are OP in each season. It just will happen.
We buff all the others to catch up.
Rince and repeat.
This is what you want? Never-ending power-creep, this vicious cycle, that makes the balance even harder down the line?
And on the topic of “competition” and “pushing the builds to their limits”, there is nothing preventing you in doing it, as competing and being “the best” is in relation to the other players in the pool.
So, if you can do 500c, and the others can do 200c, there you go, take that medal and be happy. Talking in absolute values when discussing competition and having an edge over others is just a logical fallacy.
However, if you are “give me bigger numbers” guy, then I guess, again we are in the realm of cute illusions (that we all have, just in other places).
In the end, it will be interesting to see if it is possible to balance the game to at least reduce the negative emotions you have (and I guess there are, because you are spending this much time on the forums), and still keep the vision the devs have. Not sure if there can be some peace there?
I like the patch notes, and will try to make something up with Forgeguard, let’s go!
That is how you get D3’s ridiculous billion damage tooltips.
The game is still in its infancy. 300c is the desired balanced goal. So I would rather they nerf stuff to get down to 300-600c rather than have to create catchup mechanics on corruption because it takes 50h just to get to 5k which now every build can do.
Nerfed compared to before, still higher than 500c.
There is exactly the same incentive as before. The limits have just been pushed back. So if most builds can now push 600-900c, their goal is to push 1k+, rather than 10k+.
Which is a good thing, because they were crying out that it takes a really long time to get there, which is only natural since the game isn’t balanced to go that high. And when they fix it (i.e.: nerf it to manageable levels, as it should be) they cry because now they can’t see Number Go Up (idle edition).
EDIT: Besides, that just furthers my point. The issue here is not viability, it’s competitiveness.
Everybody else in this forum?
Everybody else that is the more vocal community and is constantly pushing their opinions?
I think you were surgical.
For the time being I love the game, even after 2 years constantly playing.
I’m eager with all the new content , but not happy with the constantly huge nerf to the popular skills& builds.
Anything that is remotely OP is trashed, some phew niche skills buffed and the majority of skills remain not viable.
No, 300c is not viable, it’s just a magical number Devs find to justify their inability to balance OP things or balance classes & skills.
This game was never balanced around 300 c.
Everyone else that isn’t ultra competitive and only play games for fun.
Viable: “capable of working successfully; feasible.”. The build works. It can do all content. Therefore it’s viable.
And what you said is simply not true. The game was always balanced around 300c. Which is why getting to 300c takes some time but is manageable, getting to 5k takes hours and hours and hours. Because you’re never supposed to get there.
Yes, like in the mid-cycle nerfs where the top overperforming builds were nerfed and… remained the top overperforming buids (except PV lock and explosive trap).
It’s fine. You’re like GodSanchez and you’re extremely competitive and only play the top performing builds. But you’re in the minority, as you can clearly see by checking leaderboards in ARPGs, or by checking the build spread in poe.ninja and similar.
Almost everything you said is a compilation of over exaggerated things
Not 300 does not mean 4k, 5k.
False .
You can like power and big numbers and play for fun.
False, but keep living in your bubble. At least since 0.9 there is large player base that is constantly looking for builds that are not even remotely close to be balanced around 300. I’m not talking outliers, but in fact dozens or even over a hundred builds.
False, explosive ballista did not remain in the top over performing builds. In fact almost everybody forgot about this build.
False. I play whatever is fun ,but yeah, many times I associate being fun to feeling powerful with a build, at least having ways to one time arrive in a great spot.
And this spot currently is not 300, no matter how many times some of you say.
False. Seeking power and strong builds does not translate to competing in a spot in leaderboards.
He said that the game is balanced by the developers around 300 corruption (source).
You are saying that some players look for more powerful builds.
Your statement in no way disproves that he said. The fact some players look for more powerful builds does not change the fact that the developers balance the game around 300 corruption.
In fact, if the developers continue to balance the game around 300 corruption even while some (a few? We don’t know how many) players look for higher corruption builds, it’s likely a sign that those players are not significant enough to the developers. Which means they’re probably a vocal minority.
It isn’t exclusive. Some people just want to have fun playing and don’t care about numbers. That doesn’t mean that people that like big numbers aren’t having fun. Just that most players (of which casuals are a part of) don’t care about competitiveness.
That doesn’t change the fact that the devs try to balance the game towards 300c. Including, but not limited to, the speed at which you raise corruption.
Convenient to exclude my comment on your quote where I explicitly said: “except PV lock and explosive trap”.
Yes, and this is fine. But many people don’t care about this, so pretty much all builds are viable. As long as they can do all content, which pretty much all of them do.
For the players it isn’t. But balance goals are dictated by the devs, as explained above. Which is why they’re bringing down the 1k+ builds.
Again, convenient to obscure part of my comment.
If you check poe.ninja, which shows the distribution of builds being used, you’ll see that more than half the people don’t use the strongest ones.
Same thing if you check lastepochtools.
Sounds better than constantly being punished and having mediocre builds that have to struggle to do the content we were previously able to do. Difficult and unenjoyable gameplay for the sake of difficult and unenjoyable gameplay. YEP
My point is more that you’re eliminating an entire percentage of your playerbase. Regardless of how you, me, or anyone else feels about those players in particular - they won’t be coming back to the game because they are not allowed to play the game the way they previously were.
They said they wanted to create a happy medium between casual and hardcore gamers so that everyone would have fun in their game. The patch notes read more like a Blizzard update that they backtrack on in the future and try to squeeze more money out of their product. It’s going to backfire.
Not really. Players that like to push the limits will continue wanting to push the limits. Just because the limits are 1k instead of 10k doesn’t change that.
There is a big difference, though: in D4, classes were struggling to get to endgame and especially some were struggling to even level up, like druids.
So nerfing it in those condition is a massive blow.
In LE, however, pretty much all builds can do all content, it’s just a few builds that were massively overperforming and doing 5k corruption instead of 900. Nerfing those just brings them closer to the rest, but they can still do all content and they can still push limits.
Ohhh, so this is the core of your belief. You are basing all of your opinions on “I do not do the numbers I used to do, on the same content”. Got it.
It is subjective, but it is yours. And although I do not agree with it, I respect the position.
Why don’t you find joy in solving the new puzzle? Just curious. With the new limits in place, don’t you find it fun to explore and find the most efficient way to conquer it? Why isn’t the relative efficiency when compared to other players an incentive to you?
I agree with this, the discussion is a bit more layered than “nerf=bad”. Even the players who like to push are more diverse in their motivation. And I guess we can only speculate why they do it, or not.
There is an astounding level of irony in yelling that 300 Corruption is “a magical number” when any higher number that you could claim to be the “true” viable Corruption level is equally as arbitrary and magical.
Because they didn’t solve the puzzle to begin with. They just netdecked the strongest builds and copied them.
I think taken in isolation it looks like a decent patch pending seeing how everything pans out in practice. Basically everything here is something I wanted out of the game finally being put in.
But for me 1.0 felt so incomplete from what I’d expected that any feature I was hoping for at 1.0 that still hasn’t been added/addressed does feel like a miss. I get that some of this comes down to time and resources, but like you said, some of it feels like it’s a matter of priorities. But it’s hard to really say for sure without understanding more about how their team works and what kinds of development can be done in parallel and what competes for the same people’s times.
The game definitely shouldn’t have gone to 1.0 without a lot of this stuff, but I guess given this is where we’re at I’d rather them get out what they can on a regular patch schedule than delay until they have everything else ready.
Then once everything’s capable of doing 1k+ corruption, they buff the fuck out of mobs so that most builds get to around 300. But yeah, lets just “massively buff weak specs” (which to some people means everything that’s not capable of hitting 1-2k corruption).
Be careful what you wish for.
Intellectually lazy people whinge, this is the way.
That’s because the game isn’t particularly well balanced at the moment. The devs want to balance around 300ish corruption. It’s an arbitrary number that the devs settled on, this is true, but that doesn’t make it bad, any more than 1k is “viable”.
I would honestly like to see you do better. Though I’d also like you to be able to spell few correctly as well.
Nerfed is not the same as trashed. The sky is not falling.
The irony.
I’m not sure LE tools shows how many people are playing with a particular skill, I think it only shows what distribution of builds uploaded use a particular skill/unique/etc. Very different.
It’s called challenge, some people like it rather than being able to delete screens with the click of a button (clearly not what the devs intended, but they’re clearly wrong ).
What is the reward for the so-called challenge? Players are not rewarded for the difficulty increase. It just means they are making the game difficult for the sake of making the game difficult, which they will undoubtedly backtrack on in the future.
The fun we had along the way, I guess is the answer to what the reward is. Most people would get very bored very fast if the game were too easy and you steam rolled everything. There’s nothing to work for.
Just because you don’t enjoy workin’ for your victory screen and having a sense of accomplishment, doesn’t mean others don’t. Play a different game if you want your uninterrupted (and really boring) power fantasy.
In any case with how the nemesis system works jn the video. I doubt anyone is gonna bother with prophecies or CoF. Being able to have 3 chances to upgrade your unique into a legendery means its better then 99% of target farming.
Here is gonna be new meta. Buy 0lp unique from the soulfire bastion / Last light. Do the nemesis with the egg, or just farm nemesis for one you want. Do this 1000 times to get all your low lvl uniques to 3lp.
My guess with this logic, lvl 1 uniques such as fire starters torch may be meta. As a 4lp unique can be a free clear up to 200c. Especially the lvl 15 uniques.
I think you’re missing critical information. It’s not a guaranteed upgrade to legendary potential. It’s random chance between adding a random affix or LP, meaning, you have two chances to brick your unique with a useless affix you don’t want.
And yes, not three chances, but two. You can Empower only twice.
CoF and nemesis mechanics aren’t exclusive, so everyone who doesn’t play MG will still use prophecies aswell.
Why would you waste your egg on low level uniques when getting 3-4LP on them is already easy enough to farm? 4LP torch was already easy to get. You don’t need the egg for that.
What you’re proposing sounds like trying to use divines on random yellow leveling trash in PoE.
), so do the devs.
).