For my testing so far it has been some exalted stuff I had in my stash, so I appreciate that the FP was lower than “fresh” drops although those too are due to be “fixed” I guess in a coming patch.
The other types of things were rares, and these were all new drops from monos, the monos I run are all lvl100 & with around 200 corruption give or take a wee bit. I didn’t keep tabs on the starting FP’s, but I may start up a sheet to keep tabs on these as that info might prove useful.
The toon I’m gathering gear for is pretty well geared up, so these are only upgrades that may shoot for a T20 or better, so my starting Tier levels are usually T14-15+ . The gear I am typically trying to craft starts out with 2 or 3 high level tiers of the stats I want, and only the selected gear pieces for that slot, so not taking anything less than the preferred item type unless it is a very juicy starting Exalted with high overall Tier, or T7.
After crafting more, I can now safely say that this new system seems far better.
Loot filters need to change. If you have a rare item with a couple desirable affixes and a couple undesirable, as long as the undesirable affixes are not T5, those are good to craft on.
It is better to use a Rune of Discovery and then Glyph of Chaos instead of just putting on the affix you want. The only exceptions, maybe, would be high FP items where you already have 3 affixes you want and are trying to make it perfect.
Glyph of Chaos is INSANE and has contributed to my getting multiple good T20+ items. This is probably not as good on Helmet, Armor, and Relic slots due to large affix pool.
I have tried to seal twice. One worked and one failed. I had 0 FP after each time so couldn’t craft up the empty affix slot anyway. I suspect this will change over time due to sample size.
FP needs to be in the 20’s to expect to do anything with crafting up the item decently. An item with only 9 FP isn’t meant to have multiple crafts. If it has that low of an FP, it is either low level or white/magic or both. Stop expecting to take white/blue items to end game levels.
suggestion: Glyph of despair should not cost any forging potential. Given how the forging range is now any craft could be the last. Sealing an affix and then not having enough fp to add another affix feels bad. Glyph of despair is already not guaranteed to work. Removing fp for it would ensure you can at least make one craft afterwards.
The crafting system made a 180 degree turn in its philosophy. Before you could craft more on lower tier items than on high tier rares. Now you have more fp on high tier items. I think this overwhelmed a lot of the player base, because they did not expect this. I myself don’t know what to think about it yet.
Not just the numbers gives that impression. Ignoring the (ad nauseum) Exalted bug, Every item I take here and there at random literally wipes all FP in the first couple of crafts (adding an affix). If I use Chaos, it does go a bit slower sometimes, but Im not getting the affix I want (since its the entire pool of prefixes; its inane to expect to get what you want, or even tolerate, if its 5/30). Using Hope, it barely works. I get more Critical Successes than Hope procs (which compared to Guardian, is mind-blowing). Ive tried focusing rare items only (per what Devs put out), no success. I dont even try on commons, and I tampered with a Blue or two. Im not saying ‘Crafting is bruken l0lz’ but rather the use of FP is astronomical. As some said up above about people wanting Item Editors; No, I dont want an item editor. I would like what we had before, if this is what Im to receive. Its objectively worse. Before, I could make a half decent item… now Im just bricking everything. Sure, Its not fracturing or losing tiers, but items with garbage affixes or 1 -2 tiers across 4 affixes isnt awesome either.
suggestion: Glyph of despair should not cost any forging potential. Given how the forging range is now any craft could be the last. Sealing an affix and then not having enough fp to add another affix feels bad. Glyph of despair is already not guaranteed to work. Removing fp for it would ensure you can at least make one craft afterwards.
Playing around to try to find the best place to start using Glyphs of Despair is one of the “risk/reward” layers of the glyph. Attempting to use it frequently or early and then min/maxing affixes after is probably not the best approach.
Glyph of Despair would lose a large portion of its depth and risk/reward if we allowed it to be used at 0 FP. One of the interesting parts about the glyph is the more I try to increase the affix I want to seal the less likely it would be for me to seal it but more rewarding if I seal a higher affix; the more you attempt and fail you might lose that opportunity. You have to think your choices, and really plan out what you want to do, attempt to seal that T4 or try on the T2 and more likely succeed then weigh the odds to how much forging potential you have.
That being said, I would love another glyph that is designed around an item with 0 FP. I don’t think Glyph of Despair is the right fit for that.
I appreciate your reply. I evidently didn’t think it through, because 0 forging potential would mean that players would use several attempts on a high tier affix.
For me, its 50/50 (Gear in stash/Gear dropped). To date, I have not crafted on anymore gear in stash, once I heard about lower FP potential. I have tried McFluffin’s method of using Discovery/Chaos, but for me:
-Discovery will add (up to 3) affixes I absolutely wont use, which is an instant waste. Not a waste in the sense of FP, but the item as well as the work to now attempt to get affixes I want.
-Chaos then just rotates these for others that I dont want (in the entirety of their respective pools) draining FP as it goes
-Rune of Removal uses a TON of FP and is targeted, which is what I use it for. Remove the affixes I dont want, put the ones I do want on. The apparent plus side of this is it returns equal shards; this could be changed by forgoing the FP cost but you get either random shards returned (skewed toward lower amounts) or you get NO shards returned as the “cost” (I am Way OK with this as I dont use that rune to get affix shards; I just play the game and hunt shards I want via Loot Filter or target them in Monos.)
-Finally, the Glyph of Hope; its frustrating how little it procs with its supposed 25% potential; Glyph of Guardian proc’d way more often with a seemingly less effective usefulness. I get more Critical Successes (without Glyph of Hope!!) than I do with the actual Glyph. I use it in every single craft I can, and it almost never procs. Perhaps we could bring back the Guardian Glyph, or alter the Hope, or something in between? Or maybe Glyph is broken… I dunno. Not much to offer for solutions with that one.
Thats all I can think of to offer for now. Thank you for the speedy response, and I hope this information is useful to the team!!!
See I feel like Glyph of Hope would feel better if it automatically reduced the FP for that upgrade and has a chance to reduce it to 0 at like 15% since 25% and reducing FP is considered too op for some?
Glyph of Hope should just reduce the FP cost by 25% with no randomisation. The FP roll itself is already a slot machine mechanic and we even get crit successes on crafting. It would be nice to have at least 1 gimmick which reined in the volatility of crafting rather than pumping it up.
This is complete hyperbole. You won’t always hit what you want, but you also won’t always miss. You get up to 5 tries to hit the affix you want with discovery/chaos per affix slot.
Again, this is just wanting free crafting. Adding a targeted shard costs more FP because it is removing randomness. Rune of Removal also isn’t serving just the purpose you want. Some people actually want the shards rather than the item.
It just feels that way. You aren’t supposed to be trying to slam 6 affix upgrades with just the glyph of hope. You shouldn’t expect that to work. I would say on the extreme case, you might be able to get 8 upgrades averaging 5FP per upgrade with the Glyph of Hope triggering twice. That sounds exceedingly rare. That is taking 2 T1 affixes up to T5 without you putting on the affixes yourself.
I disagree. That wouldn’t allow for the “feels good” chances of being at 1FP and not using it on the craft.
I had one item that was sitting on 1FP. I used the Glyph of Hope because I was on the last affix (the other 3 were T5 at this point). First shot I got a critical success. Second shot triggered my Glyph of Hope. Third shot got the affix to T5. It felt like I had won.
It would also add to the unintended costs of the other Glyphs by losing out on the guaranteed 25% reduction. At current, you weigh the risk against the chance that the GoH probably won’t trigger. When you do use the GoH, you aren’t trying to “guarantee” your chances of getting to a certain tier item, you are trying to “get lucky” to get there.
I feel a lot of the people crapping on the new system are just suffering from having a wrong perspective. It reminds me of people that set weight loss goals and then get mad when they find out it is actually harder to do than they thought.
Personally, I’ve leveled through he campaign and am now in monoliths so I’ve done some low level and higher level crafting, and have very different thoughts on each.
At low levels, I much preferred the old system. Some people in this thread have called it overpowered, but I think that was a good thing. While leveling all gear is disposable, we all know it’s going to be replaced as we quickly get access to stronger bases. It was really nice to be able to grab a white weapon of a new base tier, throw a couple T3 prefixes on it, and get back to the monster slaying. I don’t care about finding the right affixes on a rare item because in 2 hours I’ll have gained enough levels that I’ll be looking to replace it anyway. By having an ‘overepowered’ crafting system at low levels it let players spend less time playing Spreadsheet Warrior and more time fighting actual monsters.
As I moved into higher tier monoliths the system shifted for me. Now I’m starting to find gear that I may actually use for a significant amount of time before replacing it, so I’m happy to hunt for those ideal bases to craft on. I can certainly feel the power of the new system at this point. Some of the new tools are extremely strong, particularly for shaping a high quality drop into something that better fits a particular build.
I think it has solid potential, but the low and mid level stuff needs work. You’re just never going to get someone to care about their lv 30 gear in the same way that they will as their character reaches lv 70+. Trying to do so just bogs down the game’s pacing and creates feel-bad moments at a point in the game that really doesn’t matter because all that gear is just going to get replaced anyway.
Personally, I’m generally satisfied with the new crafting system.
Glyphs and Runes have become more attractive, and crafting has become more fun.
The presence of critical success and the range of FP is exciting.
However, one problem I’ve noticed is that Exalted Items that I’m planning to bring to Legendary become uncraftable before I’m ready my heart.
Because the Legendary item is so powerful, this unexpected uncraftable visit feels like a huge loss.
The idea of “if FP falls below 0 resulted of the craft, keep it at FP 1 for one time” is probably a short-sighted idea, but anyway, I really want the more stand out indicator when there is a possibility of FP falling below 1.
example
・There is a risk that this craft will have less than 1 FP.
・change the color of the frame, etc.
The reason why I say “less than 1” is to allow for a grace period where an exalted item with less than 4 slots can be made into 4 slots using Discovery, etc.
To add to this I think the entire point of the new crafting system is that you are forced to focus on those Rare’s with Multiple T3-4 Rolls of the affixes your are needing instead of just finding a White/Magic Base and crafting exactly everything you want so easily. At least that’s my take away from this patches Crafting Changes. In other words more focus on the loot hunt.
“At low levels, I much preferred the old system. Some people in this thread have called it overpowered, but I think that was a good thing.”
Not really much difference when leveling since even when you found an item that you could upgrade to OP status you still got blocked by Character Level.
Thats why I made the suggestion I did. If the goal is to balance the ability to remove the randomness with a penalty equally as stiff, then receiving 0 shards in return for an affix you remove (which could be quite weighty depending on rarity of the shard) should be a fair trade-off for all, which actually solves both “reward” scenarios at once. (At least based on McMuffin’s assessment that pointed out why the Rune of Removal has the FP negative to begin with.) Im even fine with it having a certain determined FP cost on top of the 0 shard return. That would certainly feed the “risk vs. reward” that some people are looking for.
It just feels that way. You aren’t supposed to be trying to slam 6 affix upgrades with just the glyph of hope. You shouldn’t expect that to work. I would say on the extreme case, you might be able to get 8 upgrades averaging 5FP per upgrade with the Glyph of Hope triggering twice. That sounds exceedingly rare. That is taking 2 T1 affixes up to T5 without you putting on the affixes yourself.
It could be tuned down slightly from there, or increase the proc of Hope but slightly increase (or decrease, however it is proper to say it) the FP cost with said procs. (for the risk vs reward crowd.)
Maybe your expectations are just too high.
Maybe so. However, based on all the Language the Devs put out, I dont see it that way. I am only speaking to their intent vs what we have. I think the reason a lot of people disagree with those that dont like the changes is because there is inherently more “risk” vs. reward; Ive had people say to me “Havent you played [the other game]??? Try that crafting and get back to me!” Well, I didnt buy LE to play [the other game]. I bought LE to play LE, and their vision for crafting is what I paid for, and what we have currently isnt it. (Hence them closely watching this thread, not just for bug hunting but Valued Feedback.) If what I said above were not the case in any stretch, either they would have explicitly said so or not have even said that much to begin with. Therefore, my expectations remain somewhat elevated, until it is explicitly lowered otherwise.
This is NOT how it works. The higher FP costs have a lower chance to roll than the lower FP costs. They haven’t released the specifics of the numbers and have said that they don’t plan to. Rolling the 10FP cost on that is basically the critical failure, except now, it doesn’t break your item.
