The Bazaar

General
61

Having spent the last 3 years dealing with the PoE version of “trade” I would rather poke out my own eyes with a blunt stick than do that ever again. No thanks from me.

This exactly.

and this.

At the moment, even without multiplayer at all, this game has a wonderful sense of balance with its current version of looting & crafting. With most of the “power” coming from skill trees you don’t have to kit yourself out with BiS to “do the endgame”.

So, what would having some form of trading system based around people being easily able to simply buy the BiS items achieve? It’s yet another form of “easy mode” (my pet hate). All it brings is that subtle sense of entitlement to the player base, and then you’re on that slippery slope of constant adjustments to keep the kiddies happy.

I’d rather the idea of the Moroccan type Bazaar when you chill out, browse around and if you just happen to find an idol you’ve been farming for, or a unique, or even a good base then great; but it’s a SUPPLEMENT to farming not a replacement for it.

[Edited for bad spelling/grammar - hot & tired]

3 Likes
62

A random assortment of shops and items you have to browse through manually will absolutely take lots of time to sift through, and people will do it as often as whatever the reset system allows. It’ll be exactly like the new player compulsion to return to town as often as possible to buy Shatters, except orders of magnitude more so because unless they’re going to put heavy restrictions on what can be sold, top quality gear could be on the line.

When my wife forces me to shop like that with her, it makes me want to die. When I go shopping, I have specific items in mind that I am after. I find them and then leave so I can get back to things I actually want to do. I can imagine few things that are more of a boring chore than aimlessly rummaging through some random assortment of curios with no idea if I’m going to find something I want so that it is not a waste of my time.

Amazon and Ebay were created and are massively successful exactly because garage sale trading is niche at best. Even people who do enjoy it still use traditional, targeted shopping because of the convenience and reliability. The overwhelming majority of for-reals shopping is set up the same way. Even the most general of gigantor stores have organized sections for specific types of items so they can be found easily. And the reason for all of that is because bazaar style shopping is a curiosity or a hobby at best. The rest of the time it’s unalterably frustrating, time wasting process when you have specific needs.

It’s impossible for trade to be a replacement for farming. Like… do you get that? If you aren’t farming, what do you have to trade for the BiS items that will allegedly flood the market and destroy all game balance? Gold and valuable items to sell to other players do not just appear in your inventory by osmosis. I want someone to explain to me what they think the difference is between these two scenarios:

  1. Player finds [BiS item] after farming for X hours.
  2. Player finds sufficient total currency / equivalent value item(s) to [BiS item] after farming for X hours, but not [BiS item], so they conduct some number of trades with other players to acquire [BiS item].

Tell me how you think those two things are different. Because they’re not. A player still had to farm to acquire [BiS item], they just took some extra number of steps of trading before it arrived in their inventory. What meaningful difference is there if the “trade with another player” step is unwieldy, inconvenient, time consuming, and offers no certainty of being able to buy the item(s) you want?

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I’m a casual player. What I want out of a trade system is to be able to reliably convert self found high value items that I’m not going to use into high value items I am going to use, or to incrementally build up enough wealth to purchase high value items on a long time scale. And I want to do that without being constantly frustrated while just trying to find something I want or getting screwed by predatory sellers. Because those are the only ways I’m generally going to get good gear and do high level, fun content without getting reamed by it, or get to play fun, weird builds I see on the forums that are enabled by specific items.

The Bazaar as described is a middle finger to me. It acknowledges a desire for trade and the limitations that come with a lack of trade, but is clearly more concerned with bogeymen and gatekeeping than being actually useful as a trade mechanism.

3 Likes
63

I call this “Man Shopping.” I realize how it sounds, and I don’t care… :slight_smile:

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64

Someone will make a third party tool if one isn’t in game just like d2JSP. There is zero sense is limiting the searching of items.

65

I would suggest you need to chill out & calm down mate. This is not how we do things here and certainly not the best way to get a reasoned debate going with me. I debate in a civil and adult fashion in these forums, not argue.

You have your opinion, I have mine. I have stated mine, and you have stated yours, others have stated theirs. There is NO Right or Wrong to this, it’s subjective and opinions on what was announced. Trying to force people to simply agree with you because you think you are right is fruitless unless it is done in a civil fashion.

You might get more response if you said “Could someone please explain to me” rather than forming it as a petulant demand.

With all due respect, I would suggest taking a less confrontational and more polite approach to posting, and you might find more people willing to debate the topic with you. I have great fun debating many things in these forums with a lot of other players, but I don’t participate in pointless arguing. I’m too old & been online too many years for that any more. If all you wish to do is be confrontational and argue; then there are forums & reddits for other aprg’s which seem to cater to that category slightly more effectively. Have a nice evening. :smiley:

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66


67

I feel like with a trading system like this, I’d much rather hope to get an item I want, by killing monsters, than hoping to find it in bazaar. It feels pointless really. And if I have a better chance at getting that certain item from the bazaar, than that is a problem. If the bazaar is just a social player to player interaction hub, than why call it a trading system at all, because it involves trading random player’s items? At least give weighting to the items u specifically want, and maybe u’ll find it, maybe not, and maybe the bazaar resets after playing for an amount of time, or doing a certain amount of things in game, idk. A lot can be done to make this work, but just straight up random player’s items searching is not for me. It’s still not finished yet, so a lot can change. I hope they can listen to feed back and make adjustments to make this thing actually function, and also as I said, promote gameplay, by not just being worst than gameplay, but by gameplay affecting it or something, idk…

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68

Oh please. Tell me all about how the thinly veiled gatekeeping in a previous comment and now four paragraphs of sanctimony that you keyed on from two turns of phrase is “less confrontational and more polite”. If you have no answer to the numerous problems I’m raising, you can just say so. At least be honest instead of playing the phony high road card.

^ That’s what being uncivil looks like. Not what you quoted.

69

Settle down lads @BroncoCollider | @Maelstromicus . This isn’t the place for all of that. It is however a good way to get muted. Lets try to keep it polite shall we?

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70

For a system like this, I would make it a assist for leveling. You can make a tab in everyones stash for selling, and make it customizable and we can purchase more sale tabs for gold, and when you sell stuff, you can choose what class your tab goes to, and when someone goes to the bazaar, they get a selection of players selling items, for their class, around the same level as them.

I think that would be a cool implementation.

71

Depends on the quantity. Browse five stores will not take much time.
And even more: you spend time there if you want to. Nothing will force you to do so.

When I need to purchase things to eat, I have several lists and I order online, the supplies will be delivered. OK. That’s for “mandatory” purchases.
But before being sick, I often went to several big shops with nothing special in mind. I usually went back home then with new DVDs, comic books, books, etc. Doing so, I discovered many interesting things I would probably not have discovered otherwise.

But we’re derailing the topic. The idea is that I like what the Bazaar seems to be, while you don’t. Right now, neither you or me can prove right or prove the other wrong. So I will not try to convince you. I’m telling my opinion, then we’ll see how things go. Whatever EHG decide, I strongly trust them.

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72

Not really, how a player wants to interact with a putative trading system is as pertinent to the question of a trading system as how that trading system works.

We have evidently discovered from the responses in this thread that there are two main ways that people want to interact with trading. A more efficiency-based way (Bronco & others, just want to get in and out as quickly as they can because they don’t want to spend time on the act of trading when they could be splatting mobs instead), and the other which, like yourself, is happy just wandering round shops because you place a much higher value on the experience than Bronco does.

Getting both views is important for the devs because the player base is going to be made up of those two types (& players who flip between the two).

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73

What a bizarre Bazaar, i can see many players spending many enjoyable hours interacting with this :roll_eyes:

Personally i prefer to find my own loot so i wouldnt be interacting with the bizarre anyhoo.

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74

Bazaar is very strange trading system. Trading with party members is OK but keep only party trading or add also auction house. Any other trading concept used in games was thash which was user unfriendly. AH is OK if you pair it with bind on equip. Best mixture of loot/craft/AH was in WoW.

75

Not quite, I would guess Atlantica Online in its early days, when the game was still running under its original (was just resold a few times and cannibalized more and more) owner/developer.
→ However, this is just another opinion among many i think.

Plus:
Somehow the Bazar also sounds like just another normal seller (like the AI seller), bidding does and needs there no one more.
→ Displeases me somehow.

76

I want to bring in a Suggestion to the current Bazaar Idea, which could bring both parties closer together or might be interesting.

What if, you could set a preference on what kind of shops you want to see, like on class-type or item-type?

// Buyer
For example, I am playing as a Void-Knight and I want to see mostly Void-Knight Items or Items that have Void-Damage. Therefore I change my Bazaar preference to Void-Knight Shops and / or Void-Damage Shops.

// Seller
As a Seller I want to improve the chances that my Necrotic-Damage items are sold. Therefore I set the category of my shop to DamageType: Necrotic.
(Possible Settings, for example: DamageTypes, Classes, ItemTypes)

That way, I could sell my items to a better audience as a seller, and as a buyer I would get random shops of that category, which improves the chance of having something interesting in it.

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77

Hey guys. I’m glad to see such passionate players interested in giving us feedback on their thoughts in regards to The Bazzar. But just a friendly reminder to please be civil when discussing this topic with other community members.

Thank you!

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78

Sounds kind of lazy.

And as long as the items are not clearly class-bound [Requires Class: Sentinel, etc.] I need most items for all classes.
→ What do you think how my mage or neanderthal can handle void damage for example? There are some nice items for that. :wink:

79

People are focused on the way this trade will function but I am more concerned on the actual point of trading in general using gold since it is the only form of currency at this point with no plans so far on massive gold sinks. Drops are already pretty good, I dont feel the need to buy gear. You could argue Gylphs and Shards but really they are pretty common

Lets say someone has millions of gold and nothing really to gamble for, what is the actual point in trying to earn more gold? Also what will be the prices for items? Player driven economy like PoE where if someone finds that one of a kind or extremely well rolled rare they can charge whatever they want, but what will that price be - I am far more interested in the fundamentals of that. Remember people actually sold items for 2billion gold - what do you think someone will sell a well roll Orians Eye for?

I care more about why I would want to engage with the system when instead the game drops all the items I would ever need anyway.

Also there will also be sniper players who will ‘regulate’ the economy as best they can

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80

no plans, that we know of so far

I am so sure, that EHG will implement plenty of other gold sinks, if they still want to use gold as the main currency.

With the system of how only very limited bazaars are accessable to buyers, there is no way one player or even a group of dozens of player could have any significant impact on the economy.

1 Like