I have been playing Torchlight Infinite and their league mechanic is basically a ‘fill a bar by killing mobs’ then you press the button to spawn waves im guessing depending on how much you killed
Its good because its basic and has agency, you can do it when its ready each time or just wait until the end of the Map and spam it 3-5 times if your build can handle it, first initial league mechanics dont need to be anymore than this at first imo
Hmm, I haven’t taken a look at Torchlight since the first release. Maybe I should go back and take another look. Thanks.
Torchlight 2 is a great game on its own, and it also has a pretty extensive roster of mods like Grim Dawn. I know you said you werent into mods, but they are really pretty great.
That’s the endgame mechanic not the league mechanic afaik.
This is always my #1 concern with trade / MP focus in these games.
Trade is an independent issue and doesn’t even have to be a part of a good multiplayer game. Guild Wars 2, one of the most successful and thriving Triple-A MMOs, has no player-to-player trading at all, other than indirectly through the Auction House. The devs of this game can implement MP without introducing any so-called trade balancing.
So let me tell you a secret: An AH is also a form of trading.
And on top it has a lot more influence on an economy than direct player to player trading.
That is one of the smoothest forms of trading…
Well Destiny has no trade and does fine, so, sure. But the devs here are already talking about trade, so the point of LE being a non-trade MP game is moot. Now we have to deal with the implications of trade + MP.
The same one Last epoch will have, selling cosmetic & pets MTX…
So LE is a hard pass for you as well?
Still there is no season pass in LE so wtf are you talking about? 
On top of it no idea what D4 is hiding because Di was announced with no buyable items and power and we all know what we got.
On the one hand when blizz announced DI they never denied P2W at all, ever, but since D4 announcement they have been shouting from the rooftops, with a loudspeaker, almost every 3 months that there will be no P2W, the only buyable stuff will be cosmetic and battle pass, battle pass isn’t such a big issue.
On a side note D4 is shaping up to be great BTW 
Out of interest, and I am not watching/subscribed to D4 updates, do you have link to an official statement from Blizzard regarding P2W for D4. Like others, I do not trust Blizzard and there is likely to be an asterisk to small print somewhere, but it would be interesting to read if they have committed to not having any pay for benefit/power in D4.
ps. I could obviously google, but am lazy.,
So when LE has a battle pass, it’s a hard pass for you then?
A battlepass that is both optional & has no P2W nevertheless.
They made it absolutely clear with no politician spin (like DI) to mislead people.
The problem with internet is fake Info spread like wildfire& people just believe because no one corrected them. Diablo Immortal dev NEVER said the game is not P2W. They said you cannot buy XP boosters, you cannot buy gears, but NEVER you cannot buy power or advantage.
Sure, it is giving impression its P2W lite or no P2W. You can say they lied by omission & that not unfair take.
However, D4 developers downright said, NO pay for power (like a dozen time in the blog), & even explain in detail what will be monetized, what will NOT.
But here is the link.
https://news.blizzard.com/en-us/diablo4/23816415/diablo-iv-quarterly-update-august-2022
Very positive read of that D4 blog post. Wish I could trust Blizzard not to change their minds before launch but for someone like me that absolutely loathes the entire concept of p2w in all its forms, that was a very promising read - so much that if it stays that way, I may even buy D4 after boycotting Blizzard for a long time now.
I am old school, I would rather pay a box price or a subscription fee that everyone has to pay rather than than fork out real money for ad-hoc boosts etc.
The phrases:
This season design requires that all sources of character power come from playing the game, so you will not be able to pay for power in Diablo IV.
We want to be clear that players can’t unlock Season Boosts more quickly through purchases–there is no way to unlock more boosts, or boosts at a faster pace, by spending money.
In other words, there’s no way to shortcut getting Season Boosts by buying Tiers; they must be earned.
Nothing offered in the Shop grants a direct or indirect gameplay advantage. So, while many of these may look like powerful pieces of gear, they have no in-game stats.
are all very positive to me.
You and me both sir, I am a longtime diablo fan, started with the original and still play diablo 2 to this day, if D4 had a hint of P2W it would be a big miss for me, but as with anything, anyone including game devs can lie, but i am hugely optimistic that isnt the case here.
Again having some first hand experience (cough closed beta cough) D4 is shaping up nicely. 
We DON’T need to trust them. It is their self-interest NOT to have P2W, because they know the core audiences (the PC master racers) are vastly against P2W, unlike the mobilers. DI already catered to the audience receptive to P2W.
Which is why the focus on a whole blog on NOT having P2W., because it is the most talk about thing in D4. The need to address no P2W is critical they made entire blog telling you there will be no P2W. They are smart enough to know the backlash will be castrophic if they reverse. They basically hypothetically speaking sunk their ships after crossing the sea, to prove their commitment of not going back.
They are smart enough to know P2W will make D4 DoA. I don’t trust them for being nice, I trust them to know their core audiences, & how not to cause issue that cause mass exodus, that is against their own interest.
Have you seen the armors. They are pretty dope, & I am sure they make a killing for selling those (like Fortnite which only all cosmetics & BP) & BP, & it will be both financial success & gamers happy.
Nobody needs to trust Blizzard. Just don’t preorder the game, wait till release and act based on facts instead of speculation.
Who are you & what have you done with a person on the internet?