I must have missed that, how might it be different from the “real random” we have at the moment?
I would like to see anyone here arguing about how what we have currently as being “real random” try to take loaded dice to a casino with that argument.
Now its real random with manipulated dices…
Think its great now an t7t1 would be an actual good opportunity and not crap almost certain
Are you talking about the RNG function not being RNG or just complaining about what it’s choosing? 'Cause there’s a big difference. One is a programming issue & the other’s a design decision.
I hate sitting on the fence but I see both sides of the argument here. On the one hand, it feels pretty unexciting to drop 90%+ of the T6/T7s I see, and it would be worse if I didn’t have alts that might eventually use them. On the other hand, the crafting system isn’t super deep yet and it would probably lose some of its charms if it was easier to craft really strong gear.
I’ve just unlocked the 7th timeline today and although none of my gear is perfect, some pieces are getting pretty close. Striving to replace my T10s and T15s with better stuff is way more motivating than pushing for lvl 100. I like the feeling of yolo gambling with new gear that could potentially replace the pieces I’m using, even if they’re much more likely to brick or fracture before they get there.
That said, I didn’t know they were weighted to removing higher tier affixes. That should at least be more clearly communicated.
On the question of whether they should be weighted, I slightly prefer them as is for now, but I think it should be revisited as new layers are added to the crafting/gear system.
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RNG is for Random Number Generation . So the game should assign a number to each affix on the item and then randomly pick a number . One out of available numbers. But atm we have a system where game doesn’t pick a number based on RNG it picks it on a system of weights where one number is far more likely to be selected than another. That is not RNG and I don’t know how to make it more clear to you and LLama8. You can call it anyway you like just don’t mention RNG plz.
Can I just politely dismiss your recommendation ?
The only difference between what you want to happen & what is happening is that it’s assigning a number to each tier of each affix, then generating a random number & whichever tier “wins” is the affix that gets removed. It’s just as random as how you want it, it’s just not choosing from what set of things that you want.
There are many ways to apply the system and for us player it doesn’t matter how exactly it is implemented, but i guess the most common way to apply a weighted system is probably sightly different than the one you you described.
I would think the system works in a way like this (this is just an assumption)
We have an Item with 1x T7 and 1xT3
then we have numbers: 1, 2 , 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10
1-7 are the T7 affix and 8-10 are the T3 affix.
Then the system generates a random number between 1 and 10.
We don’t know of this is the exact application and i say it again. It doesn’t matter.
It is still a RNG system.
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The problem is that a tier is not an entity of RND selection. We visually select AFFIXES not TIERS. So the player expect the game to randomly pick an affix not a tier.
I agree with you, what’s happening isn’t matching your expectation based on how you percieve/think about your items.
But it’s still RNG.
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I think most people here don’t even disagree, that the current system is deceptive.
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I can’t agree. It is ‘weights + RNG’ . Not pure RNG
RNG does not inherent “equal chances”
If I have 3 plates of food, plate A has 1 doughtnut, plate B has 4 carrots & plate C has 7 sticks of celery. I then assign a number to each item of food (1-12) & roll a d12 in order to choose which plate gets eaten.
Assuming the dice is “fair”, that’s what the game is doing. It’s choosing the plate to eat based on a fair dice roll that’s mapped to each item of food & whichever number comes up, that plate gets eaten.
Is the plate of celery more likely to be eaten than the doughnut? Yes. Am I going to enjoy the celery? Hell no! Is the dice (that random number generator) not random? No.
The RNG code they’re using is (reasonably) fair, it’s just not choosing what you think it’s choosing. But it is randomly chosen.
The plates don’t have to have equal chances of being chosen to be randomly chosen.
Edit: What is the rune of removal was flipped around? What if it kept 1 affix & wiped the rest? In that scenario how the game works now would be in the player’s favour since you’d have a 7 in 12 chance of keeping that t7 affix compared to keeping the t4 affix or the t1 affix. That would feel better since you’re more likely to get a “good” result, but the systems behind it are the same.
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I just want the thing that gets removed to be of the same “scale” as items counted in the roll. Meaning, if we are removing a tier, then count all the tiers and roll on that. If we are removing an affix, then count all the affixes and roll on that. It makes no sense rolling on a scale different than that being effected.
To me, it wouldn’t be much different if you were crafting an item and you got a fracture, but instead of the current craft fracturing, one of your other equipped items fractured because it had more instability.
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all they have to be is transparent IMHO, just change working from random > weighted and reduce added instability to reflect and acknowledge the NON random selection. I’ve got hundreds of hours in and have only made 2 4x t5 items, both of those STARTED with 2x t5’s, not like you can take a normal item and do that (the odds are ridiculously LOW).
RoR ain’t BAD, it just isn’t OP, and maybe that’s where they SHOULD stay
agreed.
we me and Llama literally tried to explain this in liek 10 posts…
It’s still random, just not “equal chances”, but still random.
Most of us acknowledge it’s rng. However it’s very very unfavorable rng. It’s an item that is very likely to affect endgame gear since all affixes are likely to be filled, while at the same time being something that would probably be exclusive for currency farmers of the future.
This in turn would create a situation where currency farmers would be a deciding factor of most of the high grade items in the market would be. Obviously they would choose high popularity affixes to maximize market potential, and this would make it exceedingly less likely to find an uncommon affix combo you need for a custom build style. First because even if a drop happened with the right base. Chances are someone would nab it and convert it to a popular item.
I believe this will harm future trading. If it’s hard to customize gear, specifically customized gear for popular builds will be the priority for most trades. Now if buying and customizing items is more straightforward, you eliminate that “job” in the market. No one will bother doing it if it’s not profitable, so instead people will just focus on grinding out good base items, and the players will have to specialize them in however they think is best.
I’m not saying it’s worthless, but it is worthless for anyone who can’t spend all day rolling the odds. No one who came from PoE wants to see that kind of trading environment again. IMO loot drop is what should decide the market, not how many bots are sitting there not even playing the game doing the new version of chaos slamming.
Over all the bull… academyc what is random good or bad discussion pls allow me to repeat.
According to yesterdays stream it will most likley get changed to “one of x affixes” and will not care for tiers anymore.
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That’s fine, my only problem is with people that think that the current implementation is “non-random” because they weren’t expecting it to make a random choice from the tiers rather than the affixes.