I had asked about how monster scaling works, and was told that all monsters scale proportionately, regardless of their base. I think this already feels bad, and I am worried about it feeling even worse, once chapters 10-12 get released.
Specifically, I asked about a lvl 1 base skullen(ch1 mob), vs a lvl 55 base scalebane sabotuer(ch9 mob). If they scale proportionately, then that massive gap will always be there, and will get even worse as area lvls and corruption rises. If there are no lvl 1 bases for all mobs, then that ābaseā lvl 55 version is getting treated like a lvl 1, and scaled from there even though its already at 55. Can only imagine the power disparity from mobs in the remaining 3 chapters.
In a slightly connected issue, it already feels like some of the early unique monsters(effigy, ancient dragon, pannion, flame guard etc) feel pretty lack luster in echoes. They are scaled off their early lvl versions, and donāt feel all that challenging, and often seem to be way easier than rare mobs encountered. That feels kinda bad, since they are supposed to be bosses/mini bosses. As opposed to rare monsters (again, specifically the later chapter ones) that are way harder than these bosses encountered in echoes. Personally feel like the unique monsters/mini bosses should be more dangerous than rare/ch9 mobs, because they are unique, and should be the best/hardest/most challenging monsters in the echoes. And they just arenāt. Running into scalebane saboteurs, diamond matrons, scalebane sorcerers is more challenging than actual unique monsters, and it doesnāt feel right to me.
Iām slightly confused, why are you trying to compare the amount of hp a lvl 1 mob has compared to a high lvl version that you might find in monos?
Not really. I assume the devs have created lvl 1 mobs with stats & then applied a level-based modifier to said stats. So as long as the ālvl 1ā stats of the chapter 10-12 mobs arenāt much higher than the ālvl 1ā stats of the rest of the mobs we have, nothingās really going to be any different.
Was just an example that was easy when I asked the devs about how things scaled. Easier to pick things far apart to see the differences. Can take any two mobs, which is why I expanded into the rare/uniques at the end.
But thats the thing, they scale them proportionally. they take the lvl 1 mob base and lvl it up to 100 for empowered (1x100). Take the lvl 55 mob base, to the same empowered (55x100). Hp, damage, all the things.
You assume wrong. There are no lvl 1 versions of mobs(I asked). Just whatever base there is, scaled to 100(or w.e timeline/area you doing).
Yeah, the monsters and uniques/elites in general are a bit of a mess.
Things like Argos the Blessed? (the scorpion unique) are a joke in monos, you can one-shot that thing, despite being a mini-boss objective.
Some unique monsters appear as normal elite monsters in monos, just like that, with the unique name.
Then you have the birds of death (Ember mages), doing more damage than some of the monolith bosses, or the Abobination, first mono boss, that has such a low damage you wonder if it is really hitting you.
Then the DoT spires (wengari and poison), doing absurd amounts of damage, compared to the other spires.
100% Ninakoru on all youāve mentioned.
My Personal Favorite is Flame Spires with their two-stage explosion can kill me sometimes due to lag in an Echo before I even have a chance to move.
Iād be shocked of they just applied the same scale factor to get to the mono version (Ć100 to get up to lvl 100 for arguments sake). Are you sure they arenāt taking into account the base level as well? What did the devs actually say?
Yeah I think this sounds like a misunderstanding to me. I think thereās proportional scaling based on the difference in level of the mob base and the area level.
Yeah, thays what Iād assume theyāre doing 'cause while the chapter 9 trash mobs in empowered monos do take longer to kill (i think), itās not that much longer.
This was a massive issue in D3 when pushing Greater Rifts, you would open a rift and see Act 5 mob types and just not be able to complete it - not because they had raw greater HP (they probably did actually) etc but they had way stronger mechanics in general which led to them having more eHP/damage, you just wanted easy mobs that walked up to you and did default attacks
When I was farming for Omnis at 350 corruption on Manifest Armor you would get maps just full of bad mob types, I would just TP out and restart and hope for a map with small mobs like spiders - its the same mechanic as D3
You can now just TP out of a map right away if you dont like it and not lose stability. I was playing Thorn Totem and controllers cant target spires, so I just dont do them maps
Actually to use a direct comparison a Skullen probably has less than 1k HP at 200 corruption and a Scalebane Sabo - im sure they are the guys that ride a beetle and throw explosive spears at you - probably have 12-16khp or they have much higher DR as they noticeably live, they are one of the tankier mobs
The real question for me is āWhat is the design intention?ā
Should packs of spiders and dogs just Insta-Vaporize as soon as they spawn on-screen, or should it take 2-3 hits of an average skill to kill them?
How long should it take to kill a tanky mob given average gear for your level?
Agreed, but Iām also of the belief that similar mobs should take roughly similar amounts of damage to kill regardless of whether theyāre from the first chapter or the last.
Thats a reason for different mob size, which I think the mob sizes are fine overall.
The other issue that the second half of the op was about how the scaling effects unique monsters(esp early chapters) in monolith being weaker than rares from later chapters (8+). And its only going to get more lopsided when 10-12 are released, since they dont scale from the same starting point.
