All he’s saying is that it might cost a bajillion gold now on average to score an Orion eye. But it’s his choice to want to gamble with his gold hoping to get one before that point.
You’re saying that because realistically it will cost a bajillion gold to get an eye, the devs should simply make it unable to be gambled. But why should that be the case? I agree with @Shtrak its people’s choice if they want to gamble their money away with no realistic chance to get an ultra rare unique. And it’s not the devs job to play nanny.
The critical point is the kind of gameplay it encourages, ideally most of the time you want people to actually play the aRPG game of killing monsters and getting loot rather than spending hours infront of the gambling dialog box trying to get an item that has 0.03-0.04% drop rate.
This is a very slippery slope, something that we have already seen the effects of in other games such as PoE. If you encourage and allow people to get items in this method then you will just see a situation where a lot of people are playing a micro version of Eve online inside LE rather than playing the actual game. And with a drop rate of 0.03-0.04 then you really do have to spend multitudes of hours infront of the gambler to achieve this.
I mean the same problem in PoE was so big (particularly when it came to creating links for chest/2H pieces) that in the end they basically gave a “buyout” option where you can immediately 6L an entire chest/2H by paying the total price + a premium which is 1500 fusing orbs. You could argue that you can do the same in LE, but I can say with somewhat certainty that such a mechanic is not good design and also not sustainable as is evidenced in other games. In this case with PoE we were also talking about odds of 6% and not something as low as 0.03-0.04% so we are not even in the same ballpark.
The odds either need to be reasonable enough that people don’t get burned out by trading extortionate amounts, or there is a buyout option (which means basically earning millions in gold and then you can guarantee to buy it) or you just don’t have the option at all, just play the game and eventually at some point you will get the item as a drop and hence feel really good about it. The latter approch has the least issues, especially considering that once the game goes online and if any amount of trading is allowed, this kind of behavior is easily abusable/bottable. You just need to make sure that build defining uniques are not ultra rare (or that there are weaker versions of ultra rare build defining uniques that have better odds). Orian’s Eye is not really a build defining unique though, its just an ultra good min/maxing unique that you can use to more easily cap your res since you don’t have to worry about getting void res.
Also do note that having such low adds in any kind of gambling scenario in real life is illegal and/or heavily regulated in most countries (either its outright banned or they have to advertise the actual chances so that when someone sees that something has a 0.03% chance they are like “f**k it” and won’t even bother). I mean even Battlefront 2 caused a lot of controversy for this reason and I know that this comparison is quite extreme, all I am saying is that its quite a slippery slope to allow such behavior.
If the gambling is to stay, I imagine its just a way to burn extra gold and/or a way to get good bases with the emphasis on it being a gold and NOT a time sink. By definition with items that have such low odds, it is a time sink.
Yes, of course. So why do you think people would still be sitting in front of the gambler gambling? Also, how long can they sit in front of the gambler gambling? They would need to play the game to get gold, and after awhile would people not realise their efforts at gambling is futile and they should just give up?
Having a gambler =/= encouraging people to acquire item through gambling. You can also say the mono is there. So the devs are equally encouraging people to run monos? Also, I dont see why you’re suddenly discussing Eve online. If you want to bring in trade, would people not just trade for Orion’s Eye itself rather than trade to amass a ton of gold so they can sit in front of the gambler gambling (which seems to be what you’re suggesting?)
I dont follow this point about people burning out gambling.
Hmm ok? But pretty sure many places have lotteries, the odds of which are much lower than 0.03% and I’m pretty sure lottery tickets are common place
Please enlighten me why are items with “reasonable” gambling odds are “gold sink” and when they are low odds they become “time sink”? I dont think you understand what “by definition” means.
Well right now getting insanely high levels of gold is really easy because there aren’t enough gold sinks so basically its very easy to spend more of your time gambling (since you can get such high amounts of gold easily) proportional to the value of gold you have
Well it clearly happened to the OP otherwise this thread wouldn’t exist
True, point is that I don’t want LE to be a lottery game, I want it to be an aRPG game. If you want to play lottery then go play lottery. This is the critical issue here, you don’t want the identify of LE to change from an aRPG to a game where you just sit gambling (or in the case of PoE trading).
Relative to how much gold you earn at current levels, I would say that any unique that has common rarity has reasonable odds especially considering this is method that I get build defining uniques and the amount of time I spend on the gambling screen is much lower in proportion to me actually playing the game (i.e. in arena/mono).
On the other hand with Orian’s Eye (which I tried to farm even before the odds were fixed) you spend proportionally much more time on the gambling dialog because the odds are so low, this is what I mean by definition. Its not even just about how much gold on average you need to get the item (as is indicated by sites like Gambling Simulator) but also the time you spend clicking + shift clicking + clicking refresh button since none of this is automated.
The gameplay literally devolves into you clicking on dialog boxes ad-nauseum specifically because the odds are so low and thats not gameplay that should be encouraged. I just spent last night trying to craft a good gold ring and I used the gambler to get good gold bases and with one hour of time you can probably get around 10-20 good gold ring bases which I think is appropriate. I am pretty sure if you calculated the amount of time (on average) to get a Orian’s Eye you would probably speend weeks just clicking through the gambling dialog box (I mean you would have to measure what is the average amount of time a human needs to click through various dialogs).
This is why a buyout is an “okay” solution because it at least removes the time sink of needlessly going through dialog boxes all the time, you just need to worry about getting a lot of gold which you do by playing the actual aRPG part of the game but I still don’t think its the best solution (for other reasons).
for me you confuse a lot how you like to play and how others should play… the player can choose how he like waste his time a lot of people watch mbextreme trying 12.5k trys to get a space headhunter many times he dont get [PATH OF EXILE] – 12.500 CHANCES & 12.500 SCOURING VS LEATHER BELTS - YouTube
for me the sucess of poe is cause u can stay in the hideout trading, crafting, you can farm, many contents, can level alts, can min max with the best gear possible in 1 char only, you can just gamble very small chances its a player choice a game design should allow this options, i am a crafter and i do the endgame in the poe i got lv 100 in the ritual, sometimes is nice stop do maps and just stay using what you got and stay in the hideout, so i still hope they add t6-t7 to the craft and gamble as a extra feature for who like play that way, can add more tiers so the craft become so hard nearly impossible i dont care just add this option.
Of course should exist itens exclusive to bosses, but this is not the case of a t6-t7
For me the gambler feels balanced for items below unique rarity. The real problem is acquiring uniques. I know some hold strong opinions that uniques should be uniquely rare, chase items, etc. But with a limited pool of uniques, that indirectly decides which builds and even archetypes are “allowed” to be accessible. In an older game like PoE I can go LL without Shavronnes (Solaris Lorica), steal auras without HH (Inspired Learning), and even upgrade low level uniques to endgame versions (Briskwrap to Wildwrap).
In LE these cases seem less common. Generally, I either have the enabler or I don’t. If I don’t have it: it’s classified as a “chase item” behind A) an empowered mono boss; or B) “can be gambled” at 100:1 odds. If I reroll often: I won’t see empowered due to “early” mono resets. If I level up to see empowered: 100:1 might become 300:1 as the gambling pool increases.
I get someone wanting to spend weeks or months on a build, or portal EoT 200+ times between monos. I get a truly powerful “chase build” like CoC Ice Nova or aurastacker being inaccessible for most players. But every player is not that kind of player, and every build with uniques is not that kind of build.
