Careful with any assumptions about trading - it is unlikely to be a free , trade with anyone system… See various threads: Search results for 'Trade' - Last Epoch Forums
I think the most important word here is “potentially”.
Yes, there are certain unique items that could potentially be made stronger, sure, but there are many layers of the game that an individual must wade through to get to that potential - meaning that in the end, the effort is rewarded.
I would argue that unique items are meant to fill niche roles and don’t only serve to dictate very specific builds. The Legendary system works to incorporate unique items into builds that wouldn’t otherwise utilize them by offering the ability to fuse additional, relevant affixes onto them.
Legendary Potential offers a chance at greatness - I think it is important to remember that “chances” and “potential” are still subject to fate; being capable of greatness is not the same as being great.
What does this have to do with anything that is being discussed?
Rune of Removal does not feel good to use. It costs Forging Potential and has the chance to remove the affix that you want.
It is barely a positive that it returns affix shards equal to the tier - even when I have tried to use it on throw-away items with affixes that I want, it never felt good to use. I have resorted to simply using Rune of Shattering.
If Rune of Removal wasn’t random, it might be more worthwhile, but until then… it needs some help.
1 Like
Where are you pulling this speculation from? The early Dev Blog regarding the Bazaar makes it pretty clear that you’ll be able to list almost anything except for Legendary items. Furthermore, trade will be made conditionally free among your friends list.
Do you have a more definite source? Please share.
You said Runes shouldn’t spend FP, someone said they’re borderline stupid now with Chaos. Llama corrected that they return all of the shards of the removed affix, which they didn’t do previously and Shattering doesn’t either, so it’s a new mechanic in the crafting system.
Which is why it’s so good for getting the affixes you want to turn into shards.
It’s a huge positive. I start with Removal and Hope on any item that has shards I really want (i.e. +skill shards). I usually get all of the shards on the item because of it. If I do happen to fail to remove the right affix, I then shatter. I get way more of the shards I want this way than by just using shattering.
The information is basically all over the place right now and the plans for the system are likely evolving. Originally, the proposed system was definitely going to have significant restrictions, although it wasn’t completely clear what those restrictions would be. The multiplayer FAQ provides a baseline for what has been an ongoing discussion through multiple mediums about how the trade system will work:
" 1. What will the trade system be like?
Our current plans regarding the trade system are still a work in progress and will require scale testing, but are centralized around having an area for players to congregate called The Bazaar. In the Bazaar you can visit other player’s shops and purchase items for in-game gold. The player shops that appear are random so the act of finding gear that you are interested in feels like browsing an active bazaar instead of finding players on third party websites to trade with directly. We want the main item hunt to remain outside of trade so making this an enjoyable experience but not the clear best way to obtain better items is our goal. Players in a party will also be able to gift items to each other, as long as the item dropped after both players joined the party."
1 Like
I was replying to a comment that said the rune of removal felt stupid to use, I thought that was fairly obvious given I quoted the comment in question.
Its almost as if there’s a risk to offset the new reward that it has.
It’s a significant improvement, if you don’t want to accept that, that’s entirely your prerogative. But it’s an objective fact that it can return significantly more shards than shattering does when it removes the affix you want it to remove.
Just because you don’t like it does not make it bad. It just means you don’t like it, which is OK.
From the more recent dev blogs they released about trading/the bazaar. Its going to be more akin to a car boot sale where the stalls you see are random (& you won’t be able to “force” a specific one to appear) and you will only be able to do some form of p2p trade for a specific item if both people were in the same party when the item dropped.
Everything you and @Llama8 have said proves the divide between players.
I understand that there is potential to get more affix shards, but outside of breaking down items it is rarely worth the risk.
I, and those who agree with me, are not asking to remove the Rune of Removal from the game, we are simply requesting that it does not consume Forging Potential.
Keep on using it the way you have - this change will not interrupt your regular activities.
Right. This is my point. @vapourfire mentioned that we should be careful regarding our assumptions on trading - yet, there is not enough information available to warrant this being relevant to the certain situation.
1 Like
I made no statement towards the cost of Runes, only the mechanical value of using Removals. There were several statements suggesting that Removals weren’t a valuable item, but they weren’t considering the value of the new mechanic.
It seems to me like less information would suggest being more careful about making assumptions about how the system works, but like you said, this is getting pretty far off track from your original topic.
What isn’t so obvious is why you said it. It remains irrelevant to the discussion.
Rune of Removal returns affixes - we know that, that is not what we are talking about. Just because an item does something doesn’t prevent what it does from feeling bad or “stupid”.
I have never said that the Rune of Removal doesn’t serve a purpose - please do not belligerently misrepresent my original opinion when I have clearly voiced what my concerns are: it feels wrong that the Rune of Removal consumes Forging Potential.
I am not, and never have been, saying that you or @McFluffin are wrong for using and enjoying the Rune of Removal - I am offering feedback to make it a more enjoyable crafting process for everyone involved. Yes, they offer a unique mechanic. Yes, this mechanic can be useful. Neither of you can disagree that removing the Forging Potential cost would be a negative change - so there is no reason to derail the post so aggressively.
1 Like
I’m not sure why you keep saying Llama and I are derailing the conversation. We’re replying to previous statements you and others have made. On the topic of Rune of Removal, your thread is literally titled “Crafting Impressions and Feedback”. I don’t see how adding information on the mechanical function of Rune of Removal is somehow derailing your original topic, when it’s supposed to be about crafting and we’re only continuing topics previously brought up by you and others.
Is the problem that we’re not just straight up agreeing with you?
2 Likes
{snip}
Since you don’t appear to get who I was reply to or why, I don’t think there’s much point in me belabouring the point so I won’t post what I was going to but it was amusing, not to mention
Yes, I’m definitely feeling that at the moment.
I wasn’t replying to you, I was replying to Joewe. I thought that was clear from the quote I replied to.
Have fun with the remaining conversation…
I’m not the only one with problems with the Removal the way it is now, I see. Nice to know.
I won’t re-iterate my opinion as it’s well documented in the “Forging range a bit high” thread.
However, others do need to start to accept that some of the aspects of the new crafting are not as universally loved as they want them to be. This is a split opinion, on removals and adding specific affixes, and as we all get more playing time in with the patch the more these types of posts are appearing. It’s no good to keep replying to anyone with a negative opinion telling them they’re wrong. Face facts, some like it, some don’t. There is no right or wrong to it.
1 Like
I’ll just leave this bit of awesome foreshadowing here…
There kinda is if somsone doesn’t understand how things work.
By this logic, there’s no reason to post threads about not liking it. Face facts, some like it, some don’t. There is no right or wrong to it.
Sharing disparate opinions is the foundation of healthy debate. You’re right, we need to accept that others disagree with our positions. A major part of accepting that is to allow them to share those disagreements instead of trying to silence them.
I’ll reiterate one more time that I never made any statements about my opinion of FP with Rune of Removal or any other Runes, and only provided factual information. The goal was to clear up misunderstandings with how the system works so we’re talking about it from a level and accurate playing field. I’m not sure why there are some who are taking offense to being corrected. We all make mistakes; I’ve had to be corrected many times even in these forums. Taking corrective feedback is one of the best ways to improve our knowledge base and make sure that our opinions are based on how the world actually works.
1 Like
Aren’t there at least two other end games system still planned? I think we’d need more information on what else there is going to be before we can really drive home this point.
https://lastepoch.com/end-game
Lost Memories & something else (I want to say Epoch’s Call but I could just be making stuff up).
Hey, guys.
This thread is coming little too heated for our liking. Our forums are designed to allow passionate players to agree and disagree with each other openly to promote a healthy discussion on new and old features. We understand that there players who are frustrated with the new crafting system and those who are not. Allowing both parties to speak is critical to receive well rounded feedback.
So I am going to ask, if a you have the compulsion to add to the conversation in a hostile way or not in a helpful matter, please choose to step back and not reply at all. I would hate to close this thread because there is value in open discussion about a very new implementation. Please be civil.
Thank you.
4 Likes
There are many dev blogs and discussions that the devs and other players have participated in (here on the forum & in Discord) that make for interesting reading - they are numerous and far longer than this thread.
I made this point to highlight that using trade to “alleviate the gripes” you have with the crafting system may actually not be a solution to the crafting issues/frustrations… Everything is still up in the air re trade but there are hints at what the trade might look like…
I.e. the Bazaar system described is likely to be random, so you will probably not be able to visit a specific players store to buy a specific item they advertised/msg’d about unless it randomly appears for you… It also doesnt look like the devs will implement a trade between specific players - i.e. its unlikely that you can join a multiplayer map/area with a specific player and trade existing/old items (maybe only new drops from the current map) … and the devs have hinted that certain items (likely the more powerful ones) are probably going to be exempted from trading entirely - who knows if this is limited to uniques/sets/legendaries or if that will include crafted items of some level?.
Who knows… all I am saying is not to assume trading is going to bypass crafting issues…
2 Likes
I appreciate you bringing this information to light. I took some time to read through some of the other threads to enlighten myself and I have to say that this does not look good.
If this is all true, then I am also skeptical that this will resolve any of my concerns regarding the current state of crafting.
Furthermore, this is frightening to consider - one of the main reasons I became invested in the game was to play with a small group of friends. I have always appreciated games that allow individuals to fit into personalized and unique archetypes; to fill in the gaps in the party. Not having the ability to freely trade is a red flag for me.
Thank you for providing this information.