Announcing 1.1 Refresh & Cycle Event - The Imperial Uprising

News
269

U cleaely dont have a clue why people play cycle mode to begin with.

Once again

Ur not making a vaild argument for the cycle being reset on the 19th of September

Not everyone is going to play in legacy at all.

Do u even know the differences between legacy andd cycle play??? Let me help u its not the content.

Ur argument that players can still play there characters in legacy hold ZERO WEIGHT

U need to understand why people play cycle play to begin with. Myself as well as others will never play legacy doesnt matter if its still cycle 1.1

U nees to start being open to other people reasons why this reset is bad.

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270

I assume yours will differ from mine, so I would like to hear your take.

Why never?

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Well, I can understand the reasonings, so I’ll try to give my take on it, might differ from @oldschooldiablo but I imagine they’ll co-align.

The biggest and most important reason is that a good chunk of people needs a sort of time-limit for their achievements, meaning they want the limitation to motivate themselves to start and try to do it. A ‘endless mode’ being the opposite of that and leaving them basically ‘stranded’ and not starting it off or leaving early.

This is a decent sized group doing that, it aligns directly with the group of people which… for example in PoE don’t care about the economy especially (Standard has a functioning economy, it’s just differently set up), don’t bother with the league mechanic and don’t do the achievements as well.
So nothing’s left besides ‘we only got 3 months to do it’ leftover anyway.
They wouldn’t play ‘Standard’ though.

Same thing is going on here.

And I fully understand that.

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That’s certainly a reason some people might do it - but here is how I think about it: The time limit inside the cycle (up to 1.2) would not be broken, not really. It’s just a little mental leap to acknowledge that you can continue with the same character in legacy until 1.2 deploys, saving the time constraint.

Currently, there is just no game mechanic in place that requires the cycle as a cycle aside from ladders. No collectibles, no achievments, no special mechanics.

I do understand that a few people are not exactly capable of this mental flexibility, and that this is out of their control. So this here is not me saying they should get ther shit together or something like that.

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273

The time limit is broken. Doesnt matter ifni can play my character/s in legacy

What dont u get about that.

This argument OMG u can still player ur damn 1.1 character in legacy isnt a vaild argument

Its a BS argument for the mid cycle reset

Can i still play my current cycle mode characters in cycle mode when September rolls around? No i cant can i?

It has nothing to do with mental gymnastics at all.

We play cycles/leagues/ladder season (d2) for a reason.

Holy sh!t it blows my mind how many people cannot grasp why people play seasons to begin with in diablo likes

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Well yeah… but no, not really.

The reason why they chose this type of limitation is because without it it doesn’t work.

Some people simply can’t do it without having something urging them… and some others could but don’t know how to set it personally up for them to make it work… and some others don’t want to put in the effort to make personal limitations which would hence motivate them to do stuff.

It’s not about mechanics as said, it’s about the mental aspect, and that’s actually really… really important with those things.

And the amount is not ‘a few’. It’s surprisingly many, we’re talking about roughly 7-10% of the world population alone when taking ADHD into consideration. This is very highly correlated as it helps the dopamine management a lot. Open ended task get barely every started or are kept otherwise.

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Okay so you finally acknowledged that duping is a thing and a big problem, which ruined two of your first cycles. That is great, but what are you going to do about it ? starting a new cycle even if you told me that you are sorry is not convincing, i (or anyone that doesn’t want to waste his time/effort on a rigged economy) will simply not play the game where duping is a thing, there are too many other interesting games out there right now to bother with this.

I also haven’t seen another dealbreaker for me addressed, which is a terrible performance in endgame content.

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@oldschooldiablo sorry, apparently I forgot to reply to the relevant post.
“Once again” you appear to not have read the post that you’re replying to. Peinshakoff was replying to a post that said the following:

I’ve highlighted the pertinent bit.

I suspect that Peinshakoff was simply trying to let Fabmammouth know that his character isn’t goinb to disappear. Since some people do appear to think this.

For you (& others), it is ironic that the argument that you are making applies to you just as much.

This, for example.

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277

Yes. I know what is legacy, what is cycle. And I see no arguments from you, only whining and blaming
I personally played seasons in D3, D4 and LE. And LE and diablo seasons are very different. No exclusive content here, so only ladder run left. And you still not mentioning it, problems with tabs or something else.
It is your choice to avoid legacy. But, please, don’t be deaf to others opinion and tell us, what is wrong for you in playing on the same characters, but not in cycle?
Or just say nothing

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At the moment, yes, as they are still adding what they consider “core” content. When they finish that I believe that they have said that they’re going to follow something more like PoE in terms of leagues with exclusive content (no idea whether they’ll look at pusing that into legacy after some rebalancing).

D3 seasons were also lacking in new content for a very long time.

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I missed something. I though legacy do not have the nemesis/harbinger features from the cycle 1.1. If this is not the case, what is the difference between legacy and cycle ?

When I said “character disappeared”, I though become useless because I don’t care to work on my character on legacy. I thought the nemesis/harbinger system wasn’t included in legacy, so I don’t care about legacy. Probably I am used to other leagues system, that s why I was misleading.

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They do, the only difference was access to Abberoth in legacy/offline was delayed until it had been defeated in cycle. Everything else was the same (as the original posts/patch notes said).

If you read my post above yours, that will explain how LE’s leagues currently work.

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And then it will be a “mental leap” for me to abandon legacy hoardings :sweat_smile:

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What don’t you get about the argument that this is strictly about a timeframe, not the circumstances inside the timeframe?

Kulze named the limited time as an argument. A time limit can apply to legacy as well, for you could play a character in legacy from the day patch 1.2 is deployed to the day patch 1.3 drops.

Can you start a character in legacy on Jul 9th and play it only until 1.2 drops, then delete it?

If you bring any other reason than the timelimit, I will gladly hear about it.

I know many neurodiverse people, both from the autism spectrum and ADHD, or a combination of the two. I run a D&D group for 3 autistic people, one of those has ADHD as well. I visited a board gaming circle for a couple of years and continued it in discord during the pandemic. I joined other group activities with fellow autistic people, like cooking, and some activities that aren’t exclusive for autistic people. Most importantly, I was part of an self-helf group for asperger autists and for two years, where I listened to the problems of two or three dozen people.

From these experiences I can say: not all, not even the majority, are mentally so inflexible that they absolutely cannot wrap their head around the concept that you could play the same timeframe in legacy, even if it is a permanent league. Yes, some can’t, and it’s not their fault, and you can’t really change it. For others, it would totally help that e.g. I explain to them that they can play the character until 1.2 drops and they would say something like “Oh boi, you are right. Man, sometimes I am so dense.”

The neurodiverse group is so varied that it is hard to recognize it even as a distinct group. We are not a collection of stereotypes :wink:

And yet, one of your points earlier was:

So you can set yourself goals inside a timeframe, but not a timeframe? You are capable of planning and deciding for yourself and don’t need someone to say what you should achieve in that time?

The argument you brought here, about no pre-existing ressources, faction ranks etc. is a much stronger argument than the timeframe itself.

There is none from a gameplay perspective. EHG will deploy all content both to legacy and cycle, but in the future, they reserve the rights to implement cycle-exclusive content. As I understood it (so take it with a grain of salt), everything they implement up to 1.4 is considered permanent core content.

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283

Have we considered not allowing cof players/ssf/saf to play cycles at all in the future? I think this would solve the problem of not being able to make big changes when mg breaks, because they exist in the cycle, and as the reset implies and people keep arguing, cof players/ssf/saf can just play on legacy, it doesnt make any difference.

Heck lets go a step further, what if we stopped having it as an always online game, and added p2p for multiplayer? MG can have an online thing, and then you can make big changes when bugs/exploits exist to ruin it. And the rest can just play the game without having to worry about that stuff. Cycles dont matter for CoF/saf/ssf players clearly.

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Well, it somewhat does.

Having no ressources, prior faction standings, etc, for a shared set of characters. So there is a gameplay related argument to be made for CoF in cycles.

I played CoF this cycle just to get a feel for the difference to MG, and I always love to start anew. No stash tabs, no gold, no shards, no faction standings. Most importantly - no cluttered stash tabs that are in dire need of sorting. Having a clean slate feels refreshing. That is my main reason for liking seasonal play.

Not even the new league mechanics in PoE are a reason to play a new PoE season. Since I play a league a year nowadays, and rarely exessively, I have a huge backlog of content I never fully explored, allowing me months and years of fun in standard, in theory, where dozens, maybe even hundreds, of remove only stash tabs give me anxiety :smiley:

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That’s a bit of a reach. Just becathey don’t have dreams of being a tradelord doesmean they don’t want to play leagues.

That would be almost impossible to not have hacked items/edited gold/etc.

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I think this line of thinking is daft (AuroraClaire’s, not Llamas. Not to be too nice to Llama, he only gets half of the point).

  1. I play CoF because I don’t want a side job making money to buy things in a game.

  2. I play the season/cycle because I expect the developer to be smart enough to tailor the drop rates so that I can finish a character in half a season. Clearly, since it’s the developer’s game, ‘finish’ is whatever the developer says it is. Clearly, since I’m the customer, if I don’t like their definition of ‘finished’, I don’t play their game.

other stuff)
I also play seasons to see the new stuff (yes, I know that LE doesn’t have cycle-specific new stuff yet).

I also play for a fresh start/new build.

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Wait, D3 seasons had meaningful content at times? :stuck_out_tongue:

None, there is… none.

Yes, but the enforced timeframe (mechanically) is something some people mentally need. It’s a surprisingly substantial amount even.
I mean… if outcry happens surprisingly regularly about accessibility features which affect likely fewer people then I would argue this is actually also quite viable… since it affects a good chunk of people nonetheless… as many I would say or likely even more, can’t be 100% sure about it though.

Given that the co-morbidity rate is 50-70% I would say likely :stuck_out_tongue:

And:

Not what I said at all.

For example with ADHD everything… and I mean literally everything is about Dopamine management… which changes with autism on top a bit but stays nonetheless as an important aspect, just not as important anymore then.

And deadlines are a prime way for our brains to derive a sort of ‘competition against oneself’ from it, which is what gets a good chunk of Dopamine released.
Obviously it’s more or less severe depending on the person, but this aspect is not one which is rare either.

To be clear… it’s not about ‘can or can’t’ specifically there, rather about the motivation boost it gives.

Yes, that happens :slight_smile: Surprisingly often.

I can, I do. Not every can… many can’t actually, and some simply won’t do it.

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Yes. I know outside boundaries work well for many people with ADHD, others can’t handle them.

One friend of mine is challenged by setting himself timeframes and adhering to it, but he can do it. What absolutely doesn’t work for him is a 3-month timeframe. For him, this is too long. He tried to DM a D&D group himself, and he needed the deadline of a new session to motivate him to prepare for it. And when did he prepare? Not in the two weeks prior, but on the last day. But he set the two weeks for the next session, it was HIS timeframe.

But where he does well is managing his motivation to do sports. No outside timeframes there. All self-set goals and self-found motivation.

This does not change the fact that the timeframe boundary of 1.1 still exists and that 1.2 is still an external limiting factor that EHG provides. If one feels they need the timeframe, I say it is still there, even mechanically, as 1.2 isn’t deployed and will bring changes to the game.

Personally, I think that the real number is quite a bit lower, and the data skewed by insufficient research. The number is certainly not that high with the autistic people that I got to know in person in the past 12 years. It’s not a small group. It’s very complex, but one aspect is that there is a strong overlap between ADHD and autism even without comorbidity, so I think there is too much misdiagnosis. In my case, I was diagnosed with ADHD as a child when the Asperger’s Syndrome wasn’t even recognized as a diagnosis in Germany, something like 1988 or 1989.

I know several people who were misdiagnosed with ADHD before, and others who became their ADHD diagnosis long after their ASD diagnosis.

So, you have certain goals inside a cycle, or you don’t. Since LE does not provide inherent goals like a challenge list, everyone has to set their own goal. Beating Aberoth is a self-set goal. Reaching 300 corruption is a self-set goal, or 1k corruption, or getting 10 mio gold or whatever.

The timeframe you thought you have is the 1.1 cycle. The ‘cycle’ does not end, though the characters are moved to legacy early. That’s a mechanical shift that has no real meaning for the timeframe itself, since the 1.2 patch day limit is still on the horizon and under the control of EHG. Focus on the 1.2 patch day - that has not been concretely announced -, not sep 19th. That’s the small mental leap.

EHG even helps you to make this leap:

Just to clarify - it’s just about the timeframe argument, not any other points like merged resources with legacy. That is a much more substantial issue with real mechanical consequences.

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