What does Kill threshold not kill?

Acolyte
#1

Hey fellow acolytes,

I was wondering if anyone could tell me, what does kill threshold NOT kill when it triggers?

So like does it affect literally ALL enemies?
Does it affect elite enemies?
Does it affect boss like enemies?

I’ve been avoiding taking it cuz it’s a rather weak affect for cannon fauder enemies who tend to pop (at least in the 100-150 corruption range for Empowered Monos). But as enemies are taking longer to kill, especially bosses and boss like enemies it’s becoming more tempting.

#2

It affects everything but it has reduced effect on bosses. Cull/kill threshold is equivalent to a more modifier of 1/(1 - cull %). So 15% cull would be 1 / (1 - 0.15) = 17.6% more damage.

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#3

Sweet is there any math on how it affects bosses?

#4

@Llama8 is talking about the damage as averaged over time, but the first part of his answer addresses your more specific question.

Cull affects all enemies (unless the node specifically says it doesn’t, but i can’t think of an example.

If the boss has 15% + 1 health remaining and you have 15% cull, you will kill it in the next hit that does 1 or more damage.

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#5

There aren’t any. Shatter Strike is the only available variant of cull.

Not that I’m aware of. It still works, just that the threshold is reduced on them compared to non-bosses (that get the full effect).

Have the devs confirmed that? I was under the impression that they would have to have been at 15% -1 hp. Though it depends when the cull is applied, if its at the start of the damage calc then they’d need to be under the %, if its at the end then they could be over it before you hit them as long they were under by the time the cull occured.

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#6

It’s definitely afterward based on this:

Discord User: A question about kill thresholds: let’s say a skill has a 25% kill threshold. If that skill damages an enemy from 30% to 20% life, would I have to hit it again to proc the threshold?
Mike_W: no
Discord

But, you’re right, I’m not sure if it is == or <= calculation (so if the damage is exact, I’m not sure if it would cull).

Edit: Last Laugh says “left below”, so I was wrong on that one, it’d need to be 2 damage :smiley:

It would probably depend on the specific cull source (though they may all be the same mechanically).

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#7

Thanks so much for all the info!

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#8

I feel it is stronger than a 1/(1 - cull %) modifier or at least equivalent to a global 1/(1 - cull %) modifier. For example, in the “Pull of the Grave” node in the volatile zombie tree in a summoner build, a single zombie should be able to kill the enemies below the thread instantly. This effect should be equivalent to a boost to all the pets who are currently hitting the enemy.

#9

Not quite sure what you mean. If a cull (or any other) effect is from a skill node then it only affects that particular skill unless it specifies that it’s global.

#10

Sorry, I didn’t make it clear.
I totally agree that “If a cull (or any other) effect is from a skill node then it only affects that particular skill unless it specifies that it’s global.”

I was trying to illustrate the scenarios if we have a couple of types of minions attacking the same target simultaneously. Then if one of the minions has the kill on the threshold node (e.g. Pull of the Grave node of volatile zombie), the target will be killed when its health falls below the threshold. This will save the attacking time for all the minions, not only those with the kill threshold node. Therefore, the effect of the node, only from the killing efficiency point of view, is equivalent to reducing the target HP by X% or boosting the attack of all the minions (sources) by 1/(1-X)%. Hopefully, it makes sense.

#11

With Shatter Strike specifically, the Obliteration Node says:
Shatter Strike instantly kills frozen enemies that are below a health threshold
Every point is 50%, with 4 points for 200%.
Does this mean, as long as things are frozen, they just instantly die no matter what health they are on (you cant go above 100% health right?

#12

No, that modifier increases that threshold from a flat 100 hp to a flat 300 hp. Shatter Strike’s form if cull is the worst possible implementation. If you can’t do more than 300 damage in a single hit then it takes 2 hits once the target is below that threshold which would be a fraction of a second. Plus it requires a frozen target which is difficult on the things you want to freeze (bosses) & unnecessary on the things you’ll be killing in 1-2 hits (trash) while also heing unlikely to be hitting them while they are under the threshold (& frozen).

It’s just bad.

#13

Me and my mate were farming echo bosses yesterday (~200 corruption) and I as a lightning bug with a chance to kill enemies under 18% of their health killed the Emperor and Heorot in a single shot when they got to just under one fifth of their health.

I was surprised to see that it does work on bosses and pretty consistently. I specifically kept an eye on their health bars and was glad to see their health go from quite a lot to nothing in a split second.

#14

% cull is awesome, though it should be less effective against bosses.

Flat cull isjust bad. You don’t need it against trash (which you 1-3 shot and are unlikely to be below the threshold but are easier to freeze) and bosses are either very difficult to freeze or you won’t be saving any effort by culling them with this effect as its the last ~600 hp of their health pool that you’ll go through in 1 hit anyway.