Hi, after 1k hours I think there is a problem with only having RNG in uniques and I think the game would be more fun if there was some kind of unique recycling.
Currently farming for a better unique is very frustrating because every time you manage to find said unique and it is worse than what you were looking for it feels like you wasted your time and it’s never going to happen or that is going to take forever.
For example if you were farming Frostbite Shackles in empowered for days dropping 10 without any Legendary Potential it would make sense to be able to recycle them in order to get one with 1 LP, because by that time you are going to feel like the game is cheating you and you should have already dropped it with LP.
Another problem with current farming is that it gives too much advantage to people playing in a party. Recycling would be a huge help for SSF or people that don’t play in the most efficient way to farm items. I don’t think it would affect much people that farm efficiently in a party because by the time they got something by recycling they would already have said desired unique.
Therefore it makes sense to exclude any items obtained by trade/gifting. Only items found by yourself could be recycled and the result would be account restricted.
This is not a solution to the party efficiency problem and I think the Factions and the necessary drop balance would make a bigger difference, but still they would be purely RNG based.
You could also argue that this is more of a illusion of choice proposal, but I guess the same goes for most of drop systems.
I think it would make sense to implement this as a dungeon mechanic that consumes several items of the same unique base and with the same legendary potential resulting in a new one. That way there is no annoying orb/rune/shard mechanics. The interface could be similar to the Eternity Cache but with tabs like the stash.
Of course the numbers are just my gut feeling and could be balanced as you see fit.
I have two non exclusive ideas:
Combining 3 uniques for a new one with the same LP but rerolling the affixes.
Combining 10 uniques for a new one with 1 more LP. The rolls could either be random rerolls or a median.
If this seems too strong it could be balanced with something like this:
Recycling with 0 LP → Requires 7 uniques
Recycling with 1 LP → Requires 10 uniques
Recycling with 2 LP → Requires 14 uniques
Recycling with 3 LP → Requires 16 uniques
I suppose that by this time there has been a similar proposal in the past but I haven’t seen it. If you know I would be interested in checking it out too, thank you.
Edit: I think the amount of required uniqued should be based on the roof of the current legendary potential level for each item and another multiplier, making so it would be much more easier for lower level uniques and it would be much harder to get said unique with this method than normal farming
I’m curious as to how many times we’ve seen this particular suggestion be posted, but can’t be arsed to search for it. What’s the correct protocol for this situation? Create a new theead asking my question?
Yes I agree as it is very tedious to farm for the same for instance boss uniques and its almost impossible to drop them with 2LP or even more. In countless runs I ve never had that happen. Same with normal drop uniques. After some times it just feels frustrating. A similiar system I could imagine for Exalted items.
Or like if you have 3 of those desired uniques you could sacrifice them and get a new one with a higher LP potential.
You have a very good point there.
What I proposed wouldn’t work because each item has a different legendary potential level, so instead it would have to be a rounded value based on that, eg 10 times what it would usually take for Wings to drop with said LP
Hello,
I definitely agree with the fact that there need something to be done about farming unique items with LP.
On my side, I thought about this solution.
Which is very similar to the idea you propose :
Let the player fuse the same uniques to be able to increase the amount of LP on the one he wants to keep. I think that this process should work only with two items, but not have a 100% chance to work.
This process should be a reward for completing a new dungeon.
Kinda like the forge that lets you fuse a unique with an exalted to create a legendary.
Basically, you would have a X% chance to increase the LP of an item in this process, when fusing it with the same unique that have the same LP. The chance to succeed in this process would obviously be lowered the higher the LP you are trying to reach.
So if you want to fuse two uniques to gain LP, the one on the left side of the process, will absord the one on the right and try to increase its LP.
Why I think this is a good way of doing it, is that it would basically give kind of a pyrmidal process for the players to work throught and feel like they are progressing towards they objectives of create an LP4.
Also, I think it definitely fit as a special crafting process that you find at the end of a dungeon. Because it would allow for a TON of parameters to be used to increase the risk rewards of the dungeon :
The key could be more rare than the other keys in the game.
The developpers would be able to create parameters that makes the higher tiers of difficulty have baseline more chance to succeed in the process of increasing the LP of a unique, when fusing two.
Some doors could increase a lot the difficulty (like +200% health and damage on enemies) but allow for a second try on the fusing process with another item, or increase the chance that the fusing work.
I really think that using a fusing method of two uniques would be the better way to go as it would make the process much more clear to any player.
I also wonder if there are any new ideas under the sun (specifically the "fusing uniques to incrase the LP one of them has, seen that quite a few times).
I think some new ones slip in every now and then. Or some subtle variation that is actually significantly more fun to play.
I really feel bad for the devs. They do this for a living. Literally it’s their dream job to think of this stuff. Every hour of every work day (and WAY too many hours after work) are spent thinking about this stuff. Lol, imagine how many times they’ve rehashed this stuff.
I think in general the games needs more recycling and/or more storage space.
What I would really like to see is something like the Horadric Cube from D2 where you can take several of these and combine them into even more interesting other uniques, maybe with a chance to pop a rare one that you don’t see very often 15-20% of the time.
Another way you could go about this would be to allow the player to combine a unique and a rare crafting item of some kind of roll a different version of that item, maybe focused on having base stats and effects for a different build. I kind of like the idea of doing this with set items also. Maybe if you have all of them you can trade them for the same set with a different damage type or defense stat.
Maybe one other way would be to make uniques sell for tons of gold, like 2k per item level or something, and add a shop where sometimes uniques and set items you haven’t seen yet are available for purchase for gold, without having to gamble and roll them. I would love to have a choice in what item I get now and then and if people had 500k laying around to throw at one for a build they wanted to try, I would be okay with that being a thing.
Ideas are rarely the bottleneck, ideas are cheap, every dev worth their salt has hundreds of them.
Most of the things that are being discussed here have most likely already been discussed by the devs at some point. And a lot of those have already probably been discarded for reasons that, without deep knowledge of the inner workings of the game, we cannot know.
Not all discussions here need be fruitful for the devs, we can also discuss for our own sake: it is fun to discuss ideas about the game, its design, and how it could become better.
Sometimes novel ideas appear, sometimes it ends up being a rehash of old ones with a new coat of paint.
However, sometimes repetition is useful. The recent thread on autoloot, I think brought to attention a lot of the grievances that many players have with the shard system in the game.
This thread, to a lesser extent is similar. It is not a novel concept, but a lot of people have issues with the way the game is right now, so it is worthy of discussion.
I completly agree with your statement.
Honestly, it would be awesome to see my suggestion (maybe not as it is, i’m not delusional) to be implemented.
But the reason why I propose this idea, is to give an idea to the devs of what road a player like me would like to the see the game go.
And the most important thing about the fact that I, or any other player make this type of feedback. Its that it increase the amount of people that feedback the devs that they are not happy with the current state of the LP system.
Deterministic 4LP is a no-go. Given that, a simple thing that could be done that still keeps the RNG, , would be using a Rune of Shattering on a Unique could provide a Rune of Tempering or somesuch. Using that rune on a unique would reroll the unique. Completely random, as if it were a new drop. Could have LP if lucky. If they really wanted to get spicy, they could add a glyph that you could use with it that didn’t allow for lower rolls on LP or stats.
Could you explain why some sort of progression process towards increasing LP is a no go ?
I fail to see why it would be bad for the game ?
You already try to target farm the uniques that you want to have with LP, so, in a sense, there is already some deterministic optimisation in the farm of LP uniques with monoliths.
So having some sort of fusion, recycling, call it whatever you want (with some RNG to make it still an interesting challenge to achieve high LP) would just allow players to feel some sort of progression toward their goals, and basically maintain the motivation to keep playing for most people (at least, that’s what I think).
How could that be a bad thing ? Let’s be real, just farming mindlessly for uniques with LP doesn’t feel extremly good during the whole process, you just feel like you have nearly no tools of getting the item you want beside focusing a monolith and praying.
In certain instances allowing for a way to deterministically increase LP on a Unique would lead to potentially gamebreakingly powerful items - imagine a Bastion shield or ravenous void with 4LP. As if it confirms this, there are certain items already in the game that the devs have applied incredible odds against them ever having more than 2LP. - in the realms of using exponential notation to express.
Yeah, I understand, but you could still create a system that use the stats of procing LP on each items.
What you are refering to is a matter of balancing, it can be done right even with some system that allow “more deterministic” way of trying to get high LP items. So, to me, there is absolutely no issue with the possibility to fuse two uniques of the same LP to have a chance to get one that have +1 LP. The devs just need to make sure that the odds of getting the most powerful uniques with LP is still very rare when using this process.
And even if very few players (which would be hardcore players that plays 600h per season/league) end up with an insane 4LP unique like the ones you mentioned. Then what ? Having insanely powerful items is part of the fun of the game, that’s what we are all chasing.
Sure. In single player mode it makes no difference, in multiplayer (even without pvp) thats a different story. Have you ever used an item editor to get the perfect gear in a game? For me, once doing that, the game is dead and no longer any fun. Getting 4LP gear in a deterministic manner would, imho, not be any different and even sure, it would take a grind, but the game would effectively have an “end” for me at that stage…
And if the devs made it hard for even deterministic methods to get 4LP items, then whats the difference to it just being random. Its not like this game is a MMO of chinese origin that requires years of gated grinding.
This is a difficult topic that I dont personally see as having a solution… I’d settle for being able to recycle excess uniques to create another unique, but more than that I am not so sure is needed or wouldnt mess up other aspects of the game that would then need to be rebalanced to compensate.
Well, to respond to the point of the game having an “end”.
I mean, I don’t really see that as a bad thing. I actually think that it is way more healthy to have players be able to reach their goals, than having them be completly at the mercy of the RNG (with the only possibility to increase the odd of getting a high LP unique, to farm the right monolith).
And to respond to that other point “then whats the difference to it just being random.” I would reply that it is all in the “player motivation” viewpoint. The reason why i’m this convinced that the game need some sort of system that allow for a very clear way of progressing and trying (again, I don’t want it to be a super easy process) is that it is important to let the player feel that the time that he invest in the game is making him progress.
If you have to play weeks and pray to god that you find the 3 or 4LP item that you really want to have. Then it’s realistic to think that a lot of players that could have continued to play the game will quit playing. As it really kills motivation (at least in my POV) to not be able to make progress in the chase of big end game objectives.
