"Toxic Reach" broken

the toxic reach 8 point bonus on the level 40 tier of the druid tree just straight up doesn’t activate.
like, nothing else to say about it. it’s just full of lies at the moment.

It was triggering for me (in a low level zone). Are you getting the kills or was it your minions?

Generally minions, as that is what I’m built for. But it has been my experience that their kills count as my kills as well. It may have been a simple relic issue, but that still makes it a bug.

If it’s mostly your minions getting the kills then Toxic Reach won’t proc. The only scenario I’m aware of that breaks that is for minion poison, though I could be confusing it with PoE.

But generally, I wouldn’t expect minion kills to proc player procs. Do you have any examples of this happening?

generally i wouldn’t expect a minion oriented proc reliant on a death status to NOT be proccable by minion procs.
like, this isn’t a chance on hit, it’s a chance on KILL. my pets are the vehicle by which i kill, so why would it be segregated? if that’s the way it’s intended to be, then that makes multiplayer actively toxic to a number of potential playstyles because now suddenly you have to worry about getting the LAST HIT on enemies.
this ain’t league of legends.

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Yeah, that’s fair feedback, I just don’t think it’s a bug.

Also a very valid concern re multiplayer.

Yea, if you’re relying on “on kill” effects in your build, it won’t work very well with a minion heavy approach. It doesn’t track your minion kills as your own.

I find that decision questionable, especially since the on kill effect is to, in fact, summon a minion.
I just want to make a sustainable minion army over here.

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Thought about it for a few more minutes, and both for multiplayer, and for the druid themselves, i think the effect should change from “chance on kill” to “enemies that die near you have a chance to summon a vine…”
that way, minion kills stay valuable, and you won’t have a situation in multiplayer where a druid is afk in town and spawning vines everywhere in the world where their allies are.

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It’s possible that we could do that. We haven’t so far because it’s a little outside of the theming range for primalist. Acolyte has nodes like this and they tend to be a little less powerful because they account for all things which die.

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are you referring to the 2.5 skeletal vanguard nodes? (one’s on a different skill, so i’m only counting it as .5)
i might argue that those nodes exist low down on their tree’s and are thus accessible, and likewise the vine nodes requires 8 prior talents deep in the druid locked tree just to activate, and doesn’t scale. i would say it’s a cost/investment argument at that point.

(EDIT: furthermore, vanguards are permanent, and vines are temporary… which i would use as a secondary justification of this effect)

I didn’t have a specific node in mind but sure that one works.

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i was playing around with my necromancer tree last night as i once against reverted to an all fire “can’t see the floor” build, i noticed for the first time that both lich and necromancer had a vanguard summoning node, on top of the abomination node which spawns vanguards on death (there’s probably even a few more if my deep psyche is correct, we got a lot of way to spawn vanguards.)
only other minions I can think of the necromancer or acolyte incidentally summoned aren’t on kill effects unless i’m miss remembering something.
so i have no gripes with vanguards being as week as they are for being practically free, permanent, and available everywhere.

FYI, there is a unique which distinguishes your kills from your minions kills: Beast King

I would like to say that on kill effects being specific to you as a player getting the last hit are extremely toxic to multiplayer, it’s one of the reasons my friends and I HATE borderlands multiplayer. If you have skills which are reliant upon getting kills they’re just not going to reliably proc. Also if you’re a minion based build, and you have to personally get the kills in order to proc effects (most of your damage comes from minions) that’s just going to be poor. Now I can understand not all nodes working together, but a minion themed node, not working with other minions seems poor, and if it’s not minion based, suddenly I’m playing a Non-Minion druid poison build who has minions but isn’t scaling them? what is the purpose of those minions then if I’m not trying to scale them? It’s a weird anti-synergy.
Path of exile actually just released a unique pair of gloves which addresses this issue somewhat where “All nearby kills count as your kills” which is a nifty solution. But I’d like to see it count kill credit for any enemy under an effect that you created as a base feature, especially for multiplayer. (I can just imagine the complaining my friend is going to do if it stays as is, and I’d really like him to play with me).

Essentially make it like a “Tap” system in MMOs, if you tag an enemy with an effect (even non damaging) you get credit when it dies. The current design decision is poor with multiplayer in mind, where you’re actively battling your friends to get the last hit, and you can actually hurt their ability to play their build if your build is too good.

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