Yeah, a t7 Spellslinger prefix would help (-5 mana cost), which, along with the 40% reduction you get in the tree (hah!) would reduce the cost to 16.2. You could then spec into the rage on vine route.
I’d also go the bee relic route 'cause I’ve never used it before, the bees apply frailty for you & they get thorn shields along with your vines when you cast thorn shield so you’d get 2-3 times the thorn shield AoE per cast, which might make going the flat crit from spriggan better.
It doesn’t, but Eterra’s Blessing does, at best 16.2 per cast of Thorn Shield, which is quite frequently…
I’d also probably change the idols from regen to haste on totem (for the large ones) or just replace them with more thorns idols. And tweak the blessings/affixes away from regen 'cause you’ll be getting a lot of healing (& spell leech from Thorn Shield bursts) from Eterra’s Blessing casts.
Yess, my previous versions of the build I included in my post tried to use eterras blessing. The investment required to hit sustainable rage with it is insane. I barely balanced it with:
t7 reduced spell cost on Hazelroot.
t6+ rage per second while transformed enchanted idol affix (5-6 idols with that on it)
all points in eterras mana cost node
Foot of the Mountains reduced mana cost
Legacy of a Quiet Forest
Its kinda doable, and this is keeping in mind that eterras procs of thorn shield so increases to cast speed require more investment to maintain its mana cost. But it requires you to take quite a few class idols, which means less 1x1 reflect idols so in the end I decided it wouldnt be worthwhile enough.
Your rage cost calc doesnt include the passive rage decay, which makes a disgustingly big difference in eterras rage sustainability.
Sadly with the bees, they dont get the multiplier to bosses that the body armour gives you. Though it is still a solid way to get free dps. I personally find id rather use Vessel of Strife in relic slot. There is easy access to regen for primalist and the ward is great for EHP, also if you dont go down the regen route, eterras would become your only reliable health recovery source, which as ive mentioned throughout this thread, is quite difficult to meaningfully implement.
Also thorn burst itself will do almost no damage, im pretty sure it doesnt scale with reflected damage, at least I cant see that anywhere on the planner, so the leech would be pretty terrible.
I had totally forgotten that! That would take the cost down to 15/14/13 depending on how many stacks you have.
Yeah & I’m not sure I can be arsed to calculate the casts per second to work out the rage cost, plus the rage generated per sec from vines.
They’re there for frailty stacks tbh for an additional 18% less damage taken.
It doesn’t, but it does get flat phys spell damage per attunement from Hazelroot & while it wouldn’t be hitting particularly hard, it would be hitting a lot since you get an additional thorn shield/burst from the relic plus 25% chance from Barbed Thicket, 22%-36% chance from Hazelroot, 30% recast from Bulb Growth. Though you would need to remove Introspection & “just” avoid casting on your minions.
If there’s only 61% increased cast speed & Thorn Shield has a base speed (casts per sec) of 1.467, then you’d get 2.37 casts per sec, for an Eterra’s Blessing rage cost of 35.4 per sec.
The belt gives you up to 20 every 3 sec (6.7/sec), the amulet gives you 12/sec at 6 vines & Garden of Rage gives you a 40% chance on melee hit to get 9 rage, so assuming 12 vines you’d need 4.7 vine hits per sec on average to sustain spamming Thorn Shield/Eterra’s Blessing. Given they have 1.64 attacks/sec (including the 12% from Creeping Underbrush) you’d need ~3 vines hitting something constantly to give you enough rage to sustain Eterra’s Blessing. So if you have 6 vines on a boss, that doesn’t seem too unreasonable assuming my maths is not wonky? Plus some extra to counter the rage decay.
yeah seems about right, ive never used tears of the forest for rage gain in my reflect builds so that ontop of everything else could cover sustainability. Also for regular echoes, there will be downtime between packs which lets you recover a considerable amount of rage.
Yeah, and if you take 4 points in the reduced rage decay passive you should “only” need ~4 vines hitting a boss constantly out of 6 vines spawned to keep you rage positive on average & given you can have up to 12, that doesn’t seem unreasonable. On paper at least. As long as the vines don’t require too much time to resummon when they die, they’d get healing from Eterra’s Blessing to heal them frequently plus the heal aura from your Spriggan.
And you should be able to get ~0.5m thorns ticks from the chest on bosses/rares twice a second up to ~0.8m if the thorn shield recast/Hazelroot procs align.
Yeah, that seems reasonable and crazy op. Surely there will be some meta build revolving around reflect at some point!
Sadly that means they might nerf the unique which would suck because its so cool as is right now, id be okay if it was just the boss multiplier part that got nerfed lol.
I’ve been thinking about this build too and I’m kind of torn on what to go for. Having seen the numbers, it seems pretty obvious just how much more damage the primalist version is. I actually briefly threw together a barebones version of the character on my offline save with whatever crap gear I had and I was getting something like 7000+ reflect on the character sheet from just spamming thorn shield. Meanwhile, full theorycrafted gear setup on the pally planner I have is like 4k. (Admittedly not fully optimized, but I’m not thousands off just from some number tinkering.)
But man I really would rather play the pally. I’ve tried doing the thorn shield spam thing before and it’s super awkward. Not sure if I can justify it though.
