Currently all 3 are about items, i mean why do we need so many?? They all revolve around the same rewards?
Temporal for legendary, ok fine.
Bastion for gambling items? Abor for chest loot items?
Hell’… even Arena chanpion is for items.
There need to be a new way to power up via dungeon… else eventually it will hit a dead end…
I dont know… like Gems? Runes? Some form of paragon? Unlock power web? Go figure…
LE is an arpg, the entire game is about items…
Permanent power ups are already tied to progression via monoliths, I would not really want to have another permanent progression to farm on all of my characters.
I agree howver with your general feeling that at the moment rewards tend to feel a bit samey.
I feel that this is one of those issues that will naturally get better as the game progresses.
As the itemization and the game matures there will be more possibility for the devs to specialize the rewards of each area so that they feel distinct.
In PoE all leads to items, however items themselves vary wildly (influnence, corruption, item variants), a large number of build enabling uniques are locked behind different mechanics, and several mechanics are tied to specific crafting methods.
Comparatively, LE is a much much younger game:
The devs are still busy filling up the generic unique pool and each of the bosses,
At the moment we only really have access to one crafting method
items have no influence (unless you count exalted an influence, but then it’s just one possible influence)
many of the accessory mechanics that could be the differentiating factors between different mechanics are simply not there yet.
The temporal sanctum gave us a first real taste of how these things might end up being implemented in the game, and I feel it achieved this in an excellent manner.
Base on this logic, any form of “new things” that requires you to do that on every char you have, is not acceptable? i think this just pigeonhole the game development in the future.
Yes but it can be other stuff too. Just thinking “strictly items only” is again…
pigeonholed, tunneled vision
Yeah, that’s fair. I wonder where the devs would want to draw the line, PoE definitely drew some inspiration from other genres for some of its prior league mechanics.
I also wonder how far one could “stray” into other genres before you couldn’t really call LE an aRPG.
Hmm, i think as long as the core of LE stays the same (you get straight into killing stuff), any inspiration is fair game.
I like the base idea: having a dungeon reward based on something else than items.
I also like the idea of something that can be done by a hero for another. Like in the Sanctum, you can use a high level hero to craft a Legendary for a lower level hero. I would not want a dungeon where only the “acting” hero can benefit the result.
You are misrepresenting my argument here. I never said it was not acceptable, i said that I would not want it.
But to elaborate on my point, at the moment, I feel that there are much better additions to the game that do not involve adding another chore to the list of things needed to get a character up and running.
I expect this opinion of mine to change in the future, I feel that eventually the game will reach the point where it will make sense to add another permanent progression in due time, just not right now.
Probably quite far because “Action Roleplaying Game” is a rather broad term. Add MMO features? Bam, MMOARPG like OSRS. Add PvP? Bam, Dota. Card game? Magic Legends had that. A visual novel? Probably an ARPG with a better story and cute anime girls. Change the camera to 3rd person? Bam, Dark Souls. Wall climbing? Bam, Assassin’s Creed. Gun? Bam, Borderlands.
That’s a lot of things you could change and still have LE be an ARPG.
Interesting topic, let me hijack it or propose an Idea for a temporal reward.
A slightly different Dungeon - “You want some? Come, get Some!”
The idea is about an dungeon with possibly infinite floors which grants a temporary reward.
Its not about how far can you go, but how far do you want or dare to go?
Instead of adding damage and rarity modifiers, each deeper floor actually makes you weaker or makes it harder in new ways.
What do I mean with that?
“You are poisoned every X seconds.”
“Every third hit cannot be dodged.”
“You take X amount of flat damage, each time you crit.”
etc.
I have to ask myself: How many of these can I stack and still beat the boss?
The deeper I go, the better the reward.
Now about the temporal reward:
Temporal ==> A buff that holds for a fixed amount of elites. (Yellow mobs)
A dungeon has 4 tiers, so for example: 300 / 500 / 700 / 900.
What kind of buff’s? Buffs increase the deeper you go.
“Every third consecutional crit deals 25/27/29/… % more damage.”
“Skills cost 5% more Mana, but deal 50/55/60/ … % increased damage.”
“Gain 1% of attackspeed for 5 sec after killing an enemy. Stacks up to 5/6/7/… .”
etc.
…
Though, this brings with some problems too:
Temporal buffs are problematic for Arena runs. Everybody doing Arena would feel like getting a good Buff first, which kinda sucks.
Temporal buffs could cause problems for the monolith of fate.
Lets say I can easily do 300 corruption. With an active buff I work myself up to 400 corruption.
My buff runs out. And somehow I feel like too weak for the mobs / clearing.
(But yeah then again, maybe thats a little bit overkill)
People feeling forced to run the temporal buff dungeon every x time units to feel as powerful as possible.
But it is not.
I mean, we kill monsters and collect items. We never play a role. We never make decisions that will change the story of the game.
LE, like many others in the genre, is a Hack’n Slash, but not an ARPG.
This is what I feel the disconnect is… there is nothing until the Mastery that changes our role, that is roughly 15 to 25 levels of crude bop the monster. Then once we get that mastery its just about putting points into skills and passives to equate decisions. Then the only other role is adding the blessings in the monolith. None of the dungeons alter or affect our role, same as the arenas. These new areas are just a repetitive meat grinder without a role defining or character building function.
I don’t think that’s the kind of game-world changing choice that Shtrak’s talking about. I think he means that there are no choices where we get to, say, save Elk-Dad or side with Rahyeh. Kill the Immortal Emperor or side with him/replace him. Choices that change the story/narrative of the game world. Should we fight the void or should we embrace it & be a herald of Eterra’s damnation/consumption?
In all aRPGs the player is generally on rails vis-a-vis changing what happens to the world, which is a bit of a pity given LE’s focus on time travel. If we could get a non-linear story that we could actually change, that would be awesome. @EHG_Mike
Your examples are what I am meaning we are on a railroad to various points where “change” happens, no choices just hop on the train and ride it to the end of time.
I guess I just don’t see any change that the player has the decision over, it all involves as much of my decision making as reading a book. That doesn’t mean it’s bad, just that everything is decided before I start & there’s nothing that I can do to change it.
Tbh its not that either. These games, Grim dawn, Torchlight, PoE, etc. Are all “Diablo-likes” its sorta like the “Rogue-likes” genre.
if you look up hack and slash games you find more action oriented games like devil may cry, zelda, etc. Hack and slash does list torchlight, but its a far cry from others in its genre.
Thats why its so annoying to try and discuss games like LE or PoE, because if you compare along genre lines it can be compared to damn near anything rofl. Because its an Arpg to some people, a hack and slash to others, a looter grinder etc.
These games need their own dang genre lol.
Also on the topic of the OP, I think it would be cool to have more “Blessing” style mechanics, but we might start to push into power creep a bit with that. unlike legendaries which are items that require the player to make them through luck and farm and thus only increase the top end, blessing style systems offer stats that require no luck, pushing up what is considered the floor of basic end game power. So they would need to be really careful in how they add that.
To side track, those seems like strictly role playing games where your choices lead to different outcomes.
To me IMO, Action+RPG 1) i assume the role of a protagonist and follow a guided storyline (RPG) + 2) i jump straight into action hackling and slashing mobs (Action or hack and slash)
Thats one example, a great start. Anything but “samesy” item item item item reward zz
Absolutely! But as someone else said in a different thread (or possibly this one, no idea), why can’t you have an aRPG (or whatever LE is) with branching/non-linear storylines? Apart from the difficulty of coding & WTF you’d do with “end-game”, etc.
I mean… long live Rat City!
If someone pulls that off, I think it would be hugely successful. Like, genre-creating, on a par with Diablo or Baldur’s Gate.
However, I think it would be successful with a slightly different community, and not with the typical fans we have right now in LE.
Look at the amount of forum threads (or, even worse, chat talks) asking for ways to get more powerful, faster. A huge number of people want ways to skip the storyline, skip the normal monos, and follow the uber-meta-super-op latest build without trying anything else.
As “perfect” balance is impossible, you would end up with everybody following guides about making the “best” choices. Even if it gives you just a 0.00001% advantage at endgame, the other choices would be classified as “not viable”.
tl;dr: I would personally love an ARPG with meaningful choices. But I believe the player base we have now wouldn’t. It would work, but with a different audience.