So i’m trying to figure out if the series of rift beast champions is overtuned or if i’m missing something.
I’ve reached the enhanced timelines with 100 corruption, not high at all. These rift beasts are putting down aoe’s that cover half the arena that tick for 2k damage. I’m capped on resistances, and i was floored by the fact their lightning discharge hit me for over 3k damage.
Nothing else in these timelines seem to hit this hard, so i’m just trying to figure out why suddenly against this specific echo i’m made of paper as a forge guard.
Yeah, you’re kinda supposed to walk on the other half of the arena that’s not covered by stuff, and then the fight isn’t difficult.
The discharge for 3k damage is already nerfed/bugfixed in patch 1.3.1, before that I got hit for ~5300 damage in 100 corruption.
Is it overtuned? Well, you could let the other champions hit you and compare the damage. I run around and evade a lot, so I don’t know how much they hit for now.
I am avoiding shit, but it seems insane that given how regularly the hitbox extends behind their model its a bit difficult to avoid. As for the pools there’s a number of them from the champion buffs they get that have no real wind-up animation, you just have to exit them as soon as they appear, which is the problem, i’ve had several tick damage me for my entire health bar during the animation to escape.
I know you’re just assuming i’m just sitting there standing in pools hoping i can tank through it, I can assure you, thats not the case, i’m getting deleted frame 0 of their spawn sometimes.
The big issue is once again, its only 100 corruption, nothing else is hitting for even a fraction of this.
I’ve noticed that dot/tick damage is scaled way too high. Like it ticks 4 times a second or something but it makes any over time attacks straight up lethal and somehow way worse than one slow telegraphed hit. There’s just something about it that makes reacting to it inadvisable, you have to basically anticipate it.
Well, apparently you’re not very good at it.
You could “git gud” at evading them, or you could tank the DoTs - there are several ways to do it.
That’s not true.
Everything has either a wind-up animation when the beast casts it (fireball that turns into a pool of fire), or a tell on the ground (aoe of whirlwind, poison lines, discharge, etc…), or a delayed activation (shock ball things that explode shortly after you run into them).
That’s right, Damage over Time effects ignore your Dodge/Armor/Block, so it hurts a lot. This isn’t new or specific to Rift Beast champions.
As for the actual damage, I took a few screenshots.
Maxres + 100 Corruption + no extra damage modifiers from echoes, should be pretty much identical to your situation. I have 20% DR, so the base damage before DR is around ~1k.
There’s too much effects on the ground and all over the place with the rift beasts, needs to be toned downed to see anything. With your own rift beast and minions, you don’t know who’s attack is it.
Well when 4 separate pools from both the rift beast’s natural abilities and their champion stuff spawn within less than a second of each other it doesn’t seem like there’s an indication for the champion stuff. The rift beasts’ natural abilities have animations and nothing else sems to.
You can try to hit me with that git gud shit but without perfect memorization of physical attributes i can’t really know what moves the rift beast has, as there’s several incarnations of the poison pool for example, one that is much smaller, and one that takes up most of the map if he drops it in the center. Dodging away from one as its cast will usually put me at a safe distance, the other i need about 2 more evades or a long-distance traversal skill as there’s a real chance it will tick for damage before i’m out of it because i didn’t know ahead of time which one it was.
I had max resistances the 10% reduction from the walls of solarium passive in forge guard and and i redid my build about 10 times trying to get past this echo, first using the titan heart for the 15% reduction from that, and then swapping to a forged weapon build and using the pale ox to redirect damage that way. We’re going to assume the damage reduction from vengeance isn’t a factor because either it doens’t apply (as the riposte isn’t triggered) and I was in the middle of moving out of some other horrible shit when the 2k+ tick damage occured. I had 2k+ HP.
Also the problem with comparing at all here is that all of the rift beasts are completely randomized; and i saw an insane multitude of rift beast champions as i kept doing it, one of the versions was putting down fire, spark, whirlpools, and poison at the same time while it kept flying around getting stuck in the trees so i just had to sit on the other side of the arena praying it would get out of the corner so I could actually approach it through the minefield of BS.
Even worse is once again the line attack lightning blast a different champion is what got me, and hit me from behind it because clearly when I evaded i was shoved into its model by a single pixel somehow and the hitbox for that starts somewhere inside its model rather than its head.
Like i’m not being hyperbolic, i’m not saying i got a million ticks per second that added up to 2k, the screen told me the poison pool did thousands of damage with a thousand overkill. I wish i had a screenshot of that specific event because i didn’t even think to check on here to see wtf i was seeing because I just kept retrying and it wasn’t until the 3rd complete character rebuild that i finally decided to see wtf i was seeing as I was going to other echoes to level up newly specialized skills that were deeper in the echo doing harbingers and stuff that couldn’t even hit with their big wind-up skills for even a fraction of what these things were doing.
Its the only reason i came here is to see if anyone else was seeing what I was seeing or had any idea wtf was goin on, because nothing else even as I go into higher corruption was hitting as hard as these were.
But of course, your poison pool does thousands of damage plus thousand overkill. Don’t let the fact that my poison pool only hits for 800 distract you.
So even if the randomization was favorable, you still couldn’t beat it.
The more we talk about this, the more it keeps sounding like a build issue. So you’re melee, since you’re using Vengeance. And you mentioned Forge Guard passives. And somehow you are not hitting the enemy, because you disregarded 26% DR from Vengeance tree.
I think I see the real problem now.
How do you deal damage, and more importantly, how do you heal your character?
I’m assuming that this is your character as you mentioned that you’re playing FG.
You resist’s aren’t capped and your EHP is on the lower end, with a lack of recovery to boot. Cap resists, get more hp recovery, either regen or leech and you should be good.
That planner has only ~300 healing/sec from proc Healing Hands.
That obviously isn’t good enough when a poison pool hits you for 800/sec, but even if you had enough healing from it, HH proc requires hitting something, and you said you were moving rather than attacking when it deleted you, so at that moment you had virtually zero healing.
I always recommend HP regen, because it’s always active. People stop leeching HP/healing for various reasons like movement, lag, piloting issues, etc., but with HP regen it doesn’t matter, because it just works.
It’s absolutely cringe how people here keep trying to defend the game with git gud trash or looking at the gear. The entire problem isn’t the difficulty itself; it’s the relative difficulty compared to LITERALLY everything else. At corruption 100 that woven echo with the multiple rift beasts is like 10x harder than everything else that exists in monos at that corruption. There’s OBVIOUSLY something wrong with the enemy damage scaling in there.
Majority of monsters in maps are not boss enemies.
Rift Beast is a boss.
Basic Rift Beast, the one you fight in maps, is not a Champion.
Champions are a boss with extra HP, extra damage and extra abilities. Stronger than normal map monsters, and also stronger than normal map bosses.
In the Woven Echo, you fight multiple Rift Beasts back to back. So, it’s a boss gauntlet type of map.
The Rift Beasts in that Woven Echo are Champions. ALL of them are Champions.
The Woven Echo is completely optional.
So, you’re comparing an optional Boss Gauntlet that only consists of extra strong and tough Champion Bosses, to normal maps vastly filled with non-boss enemies.
And you’re surprised it’s harder than everything else?
They are definitely broken in some way. No champion, boss or almost anything hits as hard as the whirlwinds. The whirlwinds are overlapping or something.
Yes, that is literally what I said. No normal enemy, or champion enemy, or boss enemy, hits as hard as a boss+champion combined together. And that’s what we’re talking about here.
Aeration Duct - The pool of magma left by magma spit releases fiery whirlwinds
So for example, if the RNG gives you a Rift Beast that has both the whirlwind after Stomp + the whirlwind chance after each attack, you get double fiery whirlwinds.
is that people dont realize that often times you dont interact with damage/health echos, the modifiers exist, but you do 1-2 echos that generally chill then they are gone.
Fighting a bunch of random juiced rift beats that suddenly have %inc damage/%inc health(which multiplies with corruption gets you fucked up )
Same with fading brink like you said, that one has 36% inc damage/hp, which if you are doing 300c, makes it like fighting those harbingers in a non buffed boss map like at 500c or so. so if you dont realize your are in like 600c and place that shit, it will DELETE you.
If there is a hidden unavoidable scaling modifier, it’s not shown on tunklabs (not for Bloodline Glade or the Fading Brink).
But I remember people did complain about Fading Brink too when it came out
So I checked out it cause I decided to farm it a bit, there is not a multiplier echo wise.
But they are champions which I dont see anyone mentioning specifically, I got to test them vs similar level beasts, (300c)
They are most certainly stronger then normal beasts both damage and hp wise, and I think a huge part of this is a generic champion modifier they all have. the rare mods the champs had like shrouded, or “gains damage in combat” etc also help, but even the ones who had mods that didnt do anything for my build, were just tankier overall.
So I assume that simply being a champion gives you an hp/damage multiplier.
So yeah, they are for certain without a doubt stronger then normal rift beasts. but not really to a degree that makes them unbeatable imo, especially cause you still only fight one at a time.
But it also does mean you have to watch out for certain attacks, one of the rift beasts hit me for a staggering 8k lightning beam on 300c, because of im guessing a combination of rare mods + champion.
Psojed specifically said that the ones in the woven echoes are both bosses and champions.
The fact that they are also fully evolved probably also has something to do with it. They are bound to do more damage than a rift beast that is somewhere midway through their evolutions.
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