New corruption modifier for monoliths (Monster Density)

[eliel77]

Currently we have map modifiers (the ones that last just a phew echoes) and corruption modifiers (Monster health and monster Damage), the last one being permanent till you go higher in corruption to increase it.

How about corruption have one more modifier, monsters density ?
At some point, could be 200+ corruption, this third modifier is applied. So if you reach 200 corruption the corruption will increase monster HP, damage and also increase how many monster will appear in the map. Lets say by default at 200 corruption it starts with 20% increased monster density. And the higher the corruption the higher this number.

I dont know if we could hit a wall due to technical difficulties to implement it, but aside from that could it be a good idea ?

Maybe its a way to balance 2 other issues, that people sometimes talk about. One of them being giving more power to the corruption modifier, the corruption itself would be the factor that would make the monolith difficult, and taking away power from the maps modifiers, lowering a bit its numbers.
The other being the rewards in higher corruption not being good or plentiful enough. More monsters more chance to appear good drops.

[fatchick]

As a Spellblade that generates ward per hit, I second this suggestion.

[iogann]

Cool idea, monster density translates into drop quantity.
But I’m afraid servers won’t handle more load, they often struggle on arenas with high number of monsters.

[DiceDragon]

I am not keen on anything that buffs corruption imo. instead they should buff the low end and make corruption harder to scale and be more of a leaderboard type thing. Empowered should be the default end game where you get the most loot, and corruption should exist as a way to flex with a leaderboard.

The corruption “problem” is because the game is balanced like dookie rn, and so people are hitting corruption levels that should have never been realistic.

Adding monster density to corruption gives you quadratic scaling. you get more rarity AND more quantity, these multiply together in terms of item gains.

Which would mean builds which push the highest corruption get the most gear, which means they can go even higher even faster and it pushes out any other build from being worth playing. imagine getting 70% less loot because you are not farming 1000 corruption. Yuck.

[eliel77]

@DiceDragon

I am not keen on anything that buffs corruption imo.

This time we are taking opposite sides.
I really think that higher density of monsters would help creating a more thrilling experience with monoliths and also would help to deal with the lack of perception that we are having indeed increased drops.
Not to mention the obvious but no less important point, it would help another old issue that is often getting complaints, maps with no monsters here and there, where the player just travel a good part of the map with no further interaction.
This problem has been highlighted once again with new Ambush maps. It’s a pain in the ass chasing mobs in some low density maps to lure the ambush. Something they could use to spice things up turned to be a downside.

Here is very good and deep topic about somethings I have mentioned here. How monsters density is not really well designed in the game right now and how the “exploration” of maps is not being encouraged. We have dozens of other posts like this, but sometimes not very well elaborated.
(20) Exploration is not rewarded enough in this game. : LastEpoch (reddit.com)

Sooner or later this will have to be addressed.

@DiceDragon

Adding monster density to corruption gives you quadratic scaling. you get more rarity AND more quantity, these multiply together in terms of item gains.

I think its just overreacting here… Quadratic scaling ?
Rarity itself barely scales anything on monoliths, and its another complaint because many times we do not perceive our effort translating in rewards.

@DiceDragon

The corruption “problem” is because the game is balanced like dookie rn, and so people are hitting corruption levels that should have never been realistic.

I have been “hearing” for some time this thing about corruption , that players shouldn’t be able to go so higher in corruption. And I strongly disagree. This is the one thing we have for endgame and that I personally like and many times it’s my motivation to pushing builds to their limit and go after greater gear.
A good game should incentive that, give the player emotion, a thrilling experience.
My take is that corruption should have better ways to be increased, as long as your build is capable, and the they should improve the trhilling factor in the experience of running monoliths over and over. Maybe when more endgame content is added, I can change my perception.
Right now I think there is no such thing as not realistic about the way we play. This is what the game turned to be to the very enthusiastic of this game, scaling corruption to 500+, 700+ 1000+…

@DiceDragon

Which would mean builds which push the highest corruption get the most gear, which means they can go even higher even faster and it pushes out any other build from being worth playing. imagine getting 70% less loot because you are not farming 1000 corruption. Yuck.

My take on this is very simple. People who invest time to create great builds and have the dedication to achieve higher levels , higher contet, do have to get better rewards. You are saying something as people who run middle content can not get good things. And its not true. The game is accesible to almost any build and all things are available in 200 corruption ( a pretty low standard these times).

Just to finish, by no means I want to discourage build diversity. I think its great for the game and increase players. But it cant be at the cost of making everything “on the same level”.
What I think that is unrealistic is this utopian thought that you guys bring sometimes about every possible build in the game being able to do very high levels of content and drops should be almost even in any part of the game so that “strong” builds dont get favored.
No game is capable of this and no game can “survive” this.
Its part of the gamer experience to chase things and get exciment and thrilling having the perception of getting stronger and achieving better things. While I say this, I do think games should have a way to balance things so that people who play everyday dont get too many power and casual players dont get access to good things. But this is the one thing the game already does very well. I dont think my suggestion would ruin it. I hate P2W games. I hate games whose experience obbey the player to log in everyday, sometimes we take the game as a job. Last years I did not enjoy very much my Lost Ark experience, and I hated my Diablo Immortal experience.

[DiceDragon]

My main issue is the scale rn.

this would make total sense in a world where the worst build does 100, and the best does like 400. the 400 guy can afford to get 2-3x the loot. But lets change the scale to current corruption numbers we see.

So the 100 corruption guy gets baseline loot, and the 2500 corruption static orb guy should get 25x the loot? no way.

Right now the game has to be balanced first before we can change corruption. Because there is too much of a gap between the run of the mill builds and the builds that are pushing insanely high values. When I first started playing, 800-1000 corruption was like peak, and there was like 1 dude doing, the other big pushers were like 500-700.

Now we have multiple people at 1k+ and several people at 1.5k+. The devs dont even want people at this corruption.

Again its a scale thing. A pretty chill build can get 200-300 maybe even 400 arena waves on a good build. And the strongest arena builds get 1000. if arena had loot, and loot scaling rewards, the best players would only get 3-5x the loot, which I think is fair.

[eliel77]

I just saw one build doing 2000+ corruption, and I imagine the time and effort he had to put in it… Not to mention he had to slowly walk and kill enemies along the way in echoes

I see your point and I also agree we could have a better scale. Sometimes I suggest things already thinking in what the Devs might do for the future of the game. I trust they will balance things better and I think monster density could be an interesting add on to mix things up, to spice things up and to help to fix some issues. Maybe make it slowly increase and cap it 500 (just an example). 200+ corruption 20% increased monster density, and 500+ we achieve the maximum of 50% increased monster density.
Its just one thing that if well thought could work very well with the way the game is.