You said that it’s comparable to ward stacking in terms of what corruption level, dungeon tier, and difficulty level people can get to; I pointed out that this is wrong (not directly, but more EHP equals higher achievable corruption, at least to a certain level where survivability still matters), and so did Athamo (also, dungeon tier? really?).
Merriam-webster also defines “viable” as " capable of working, functioning, or developing adequately if we’re really going that route. But I do admit that you’re right in that specific context when talking about very casual levels of corruption levels, but OP is clearly talking about the huge power gap he thinks there is between those 2 defensive layers, and not if you can do lvl 90 monos with a build that depends on HP for defense.
Yes.
Yes, so where did i changed my stance? those are two different problems.
Magical barrier is a problem.
Stack int to improved magical barrier is another problem.
I think both of them are bad simultaneosly. I didn’t changed anything.
Yes, this is a distinct problem.
You are literally wrong.
My MAIN issue is with ward. This is how i prove to you I DIDN’T CHANGED.
My first post is about ward. All top 5 you mentioned are playing with ward 
Just as a sidenote: the top 6 builds on ladder don’t use ward at all.
Why are you talking about something you don’t understand?
If thats not the case, why are you lying?
Did you want me to read what Grim Constitution does?
You changed stances by “moving the goal post.” if you can’t refute my statement except by saying “you are literally wrong” and/or changing the subject to a new point. That’s called changing your stance.
As I and others have said, you don’t need to stack ward to be viable and none of the top builds in arena stack ward.
None of the top forge guards stack INT because Stacking INT isn’t as good as Stacking Str for ward builds (at least for Sentinel Ward builds). That’s a fact. Ward Retention is not as good as armor as armor applies to ward and HP and most of your skills will scale with Str and not int.
But keep telling us how wrong we are lol
Lying again? i didn’t changed the goal of the post a single time.
If i say i don’t like color RED and you ask “what about orange color?”
I’m not changing because you ask me to elaborate about orange.
My point is X and you asked about Y.
None of the top 3 builds use it.
Wudi is at the top of the arena for 1.1 and he uses avalanche shaman which produces around 200-500 ward. That’s not a ward build. Same for #2. #3 does use ward, but #4 (the top sentinel) also doesn’t. #5 is a rogue that doesn’t use ward and #6 is the same build as the first 2.
So from the top 6, you have 1 build that uses ward as a defense as opposed to health and you have 0 builds that use Grim Constitution. I just checked the ladder on the site and checked their profiles and their build.
But I can tell already how this discourse will go on with escalating insults, so I’m done. Enjoy your point of view, even though it’s clearly shown wrong.
Oh no, Athamos turned into one of them…
Man… the fact that none of the top builds in the ladder stack Ward should be more than enough for you to realize that the entirety of your main argument, regarding your massive problem with LE, is flawed.
I wasn’t even aware of that, and do not care to check. But it really indicates how wrong you are from the begining.
Yes, comparable. Correct. You saying that one is better still falls in the definition of comparable … I never said ward wasn’t better, I simply said that HP is viable to complete the available content.
I mentioned T4 dungeons, because T4 Julra was previously the hardest boss in the game …
I never said anything about level 90 monos so I don’t know why you are referring to those … I said a level 90 character can easily do 200+ corruption level.
Top 6, now top 3…
Forgemaster uses both constitution and divine barrier. You are lying.
Gege, 5#, uses divine barrier. Lying again.
Top 1 beastmaster, cleaversolution + full gear based on missinghealth per ward, lying again.
Rank 1: Doesn’t stack ward.
Rank 2: stacks ward OUT OF COMBAT with Grim Constitution
Rank 3: gets some ward through glacier crits, focus, and Sorc passives, but nothing I’d call “Stacking.”
Rank 4: Again, some ward generation but nothing close to “ward Stacking.”
Rank 5: uses HH to generate Ward, the closest thing to “ward Stacking” on this list.
Should I continue?
Actually, I had consulted the wrong profile. #3 is a falconer, so they don’t use ward either. None fo the top 6 do, or use Grim Constitution.
Wtf is Gege?
And yeah, I can see this is going to turn into a discussion where you just acuse people of lying and it will only escalate to name calling, so be my guest and continue this without me.
Firstly:
Moving the goalposts (or shifting the goalposts) is a metaphor, derived from goal-based sports such as football and hockey, that means to change the rule or criterion (goal) of a process or competition while it is still in progress, in such a way that the new goal offers one side an advantage or disadvantage.
Secondly, you said “I don’t like red because X” and I said “but X doesn’t apply to red.” and you said “but orange has y!”
I showed you how the conversation flowed earlier.
He’s looking at the LETools ladder. Same one I was referring to.
You said this /
And then complement your post with "he use ward but as a sorcerer, he use ward but gain 54% health as ward PER SECOND out of combat, uses HH to generate ward, Ward generation but nothing close.
How these descriptions are about “NO WARD AT ALL”? are you delusional?
DJ and I are looking at different sites. It still doesn’t change that ward Stacking isn’t a thing in any of the top 5 builds shown on LETools. The closest to ward Stacking is gege’s build at rank 5 and Grim Constitution doesn’t generate ward in combat.
For this sentence to be even remotely true, we should have AT LEAST the top 3 builds in the ladder all stacking ward, followed by at least 4/5 others in the top 10 list.
Now you’re just on a loop-hole, lying to yourself just to try and prove an invalid point…
If you don’t feel like playing anymore, just move on… There’s really no need for all this. Friggin 50+ replies on this thread, such a waste.
Even looking at LETools (which shows the same thing as the game, so I assume EHG’s site is inaccurate), the top FG is ForgeMaster which has 500 more levels than Gege, and that build doesn’t use ward. And the #1 is a Falconer which doesn’t either. and has over 500 waves more than the first ward build.
So not only are health builds at the top (thus viable by any metric you want to use) the top FG also is a health build at the top.
The funniest thing is seeing people try to justify that WARD is not a problem and thus creating a new group called “Stacking Ward” as if it were a separate problem.
With or without “stacking” ward is a problem, actually if they are NOT stacking ward and yet outperforming everyone else it makes my argument stronger.
Ward isn’t a problem because ward is just another layer of defense, just like resistance, or endurance, or armor.
Ward BECOMES a problem when you have situations like in 1.0 where you could stack ward infinitely and literally out generate the incoming damage. This is no longer the case. As is proof by the ladders and the fact that so many people were complaining that Ward “is dead” on 1.1’s Ward Changes announcement.