That maybe true, but we are talking the difference between solo and MP game play rewards. My point is why should a player get a juicy reward for trivializing the content when a more fair fight would gain them better rewards.
Yeah, I didn’t talk about that, just the “over farming/excessive spawning” timer thing you posted. No need for that in LE, since there will be no market or trading.
I think it can be a bit difficult to program “character potency” and even “player skill” into a reward system. I know some games use a “gear score” for how potent the gear is of the character. Not 100% sure that works in LE. Example: a T6 affix which just happens to be on your gear because, well, that’s the item you found, but that T6 has nothing to do with your build (poison damage on a non-poison build, for example). It would be hard for code logic to know that T6 shouldn’t add to your gear score.
As far as player skill, often times build trumps skills. i.e. you take Werebear Earthquake on a player with mediocre skills vs. a Flow-based Rogue on a player with very high skills, and the Rogue might kill slower, take more damage, etc. Again, its nearly impossible to code the right logic to determine player skill.
The best idea I can even come up with here is DPS (and group DPS) applied to enemies. Why? Because, regardless of skill, build, etc. the lower DPS you have the longer the fight (and enemies live longer, meaning they hit you more). Its crude, but I can’t even think of another way to program a system which increases rewards based on “a harder experience” (aka higher Risk). You could also toss in character(s) level, but it should be a smaller factor.
Then I am in parallel with you, not aligned. I am not against a DPS style but since LE cannot seem to calculate that correctly is why I has my suspicions about using that as a type of regulator.
I was thinking that, instead of measuring DPS on the skill, they would measure “damage received per second” on the actual monsters, since that’s happening in real-time. They can then adjust the Risk-v-Reward metric every 10 kills, or every 10 seconds, or something like that. Or maybe just less frequently, like each Mono completion you get the average that the entire party did, and then set that on those characters so long as no one leaves or joins that party. (would apply to solo also). Then you can set the Rewards at the beginning (creation) of the mono based on the ranking. Something like that.
Now that is more like it. Again still goes back to how the DPS gets calculated in the output of character verses input on monster. That is an area that still feels off for some skills. Your suggestion would be easier to implement.
Thank god you’re not a dev.
Clearly you have zero idea about MP balance.
Apparently I have more than you, since you didn’t actually post anything…
Most players, including devs, discuss MP balance around increasing enemies hp but not dmg. Try to think abit and guess why.
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Good thing I didn’t propose increasing damage just because there are more players. Whew!
I said that there are already modifiers which are optional for every mono node.
- Increased endurance
- Increased health
- Chance to Dodge
- Increased damage
- etc.
When you add players, you increase that mod’s strength by some % based on # of players.
Reading comprehension FTW!
And after comprehending, you need to have the brains to think about the implications of what said proposed scaling do. Some of those scaling will make sense for a team, others wont. Or at least it would pigeon-hole team configurations. These are things a dev would need to consider. Not just make some blanket idea.
Increasing health with more players make sense because the collective damage of the team is almost definitely bound to be higher than the individual. But a team doesnt necessarily increase the tankiness of each individual to take damage. Or the ability of each individual to hit more accurately. These make scaling damage, dodge rate much much harder than something like increased health unless there is some specific party buff to mitigate those, and hence wrap the MP meta around teams that has such specific buffs.
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Good thing my idea wasn’t a Coding Spec already handed to the devs, and also wasn’t thorough or complete, and was even proposed as “an idea”, huh?
Reading comprehension still FTW.
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Enemies deal 5% more damage (becomes 10%, 15% or 20% with 2,3 or 4 players). Gee, I run +20% all the time and I don’t get one-shot. Maybe the devs have to just, you know, scale this one way more easy than they scale the others.
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Enemies have 50% more health (or 100%, or 150%, or 200% for 2,3,4 players). Gee, this one scales nicely!
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Rare enemies deal 75% more Void damage (or 85%, or 95%, or 105% for 2,3,4 players). Wow, I scaled this one way more easy, and look, it doesn’t really one shot anyone!
Maybe if you asked for clarification on my quick idea instead of being like “You’d suck as a dev” (and p.s. I have 32 years experience as a developer, likely more than Mike + his next two best developers combined).
Yea. Wondering what you’ve been doing in those 32 years 
My primary issue with MP is that it should not be a pinata loot explosion festival that puts those who want and will play MP but not as their primary mode to be set so far behind the curve that it reduces the chances of getting good match-making groups to work. I guess I am just going to have to wait and see, I just do not want it to turn into PoE hellscape.
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I agree, but I also think that Risk vs. Reward should be honored. It would kinda stink if Monos (for example) were just harder, but for the exact same loot you’d get solo.
Per Jerle’s comment, I think maybe something like this (just an idea - hint hint):
- Modifiers which are highly offensive: +10% / +20% / +30%, boost loot “the most” (whatever that ends up meaning)
- Modifiers which are mildly offensive/defensive: +20% / +40% / +60%, boost loot “a middle amount”
- Modifiers which are highly defensive: +50% / + 75% / +100%, boost loot “the least”
So, you run a mono with 4 people, and the mono happens to have:
- Void enemies deal 75% increased damage
- enemies have +20% critical strike chance (not increased, flat +20%)
- enemies have 25% more health
- enemies have a 15% chance to Chill on hit
This would translate as follows:
- Void enemies deal 105% increased damage (high loot bonus)
- enemies have +50% critical strike chance (high loot bonus)
- enemies have 125% more health (low loot bonus)
- enemies have a 75% chance to Chill on hit (medium loot bonus)
With something like (but not necessarily precisely) this, I feel that grouping would provide more Risk and more Reward, yet not become some “Pinata Loot Explosion Festival”, as you put it so nicely. 
It would also let Parties decide what Mono modifiers they want to run.
- Party of all Tanks? Run those high offensive nodes and rake in loot
- Party of all Glass Cannons? Run those high defensive nodes, well, your loot is a bit nicer…
Edit: including a screenshot of the basic idea (not meant as a final coding spec!)
So everyone agrees they should even be considering this at all to entice people to play MP? Increase drop rate and exp reward?
Because absence of evidence is evidence of absence.
I think everybody agrees that the devs need to think about the xp/loot buffs (if there are any, I’m still not set that there need to be any) which is all Stanz said. I don’t think one should read much more into his statement than that.
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A problem with something like that is that it disincentives or punishes the player for min/maxing their build. There was a brief period in LE where bosses had a rather hard stacking % damage mitigation. If you had a high dps build you’d been through the boss and they would quickly gain a lot of % mitigation such that your dps could drop to a miniscule amount. Needless to say, the community didn’t particularly enjoy it and it was tweaked though not completely removed.
You did though (“whew!”), I know the numbers would just have been pulled out of your arse, but you certainly did suggest that them mobs do more damage based on the number of players (up to 100% more for 4 players!):
Also, why should mp give an xp/loot bonus? You’ll already get more loot per unit time due to to more players killing faster than fewer players (assuming builds of equal power). IMO, the mob hp should scale slightly slower than the number of players (so 2 for players the mobs have slightly under double hp that they would have in SP, for 3 players they would have slightly less than triple the solo hp, etc). That way you’d kill at a similar speed (ish) gain similar amounts of “direct” loot from mobs plus some “indirect” loot (from your party members giving you some of their loot that they don’t/can’t use) and you’d get similar amounts of xp per unit time.
I think when some people cite POE and highlight how the game has loot bonus (I dont think there is group xp bonus btw. If there is, it is not significant), they fail to recognise the game doesnt have instanced loot. So more loot is needed to be “shared” among the party.
Since LE plans to have instanced loot, I completely agree with you loot bonus isnt necessary.
Yes +1
Although they could disguise “more loots” as “special MP quest” that gives such rewards as incentives.