This question arose at 1000+ corruption, when it is very important what and how your character does.
I found that the skill becomes 95% less usable, since it is uncontrolled by distance.
Is there a small chance that skills such as Rogues “Shift” will be used at the targeted location, and not at the maximum distance into a bunch of enemies, pools with dot damage and other bloody hell?
In the game, during the bossfight, half of the arena is filled with oneshoot mechanics. At the same time, the only shifting skill is not controlled by the player.
Shift and Surge are the only movement skills with a fixed distance, which makes them feel less replaceable and more special compared to other movement skills.
(To a lesser extend there are some other skills that have also a fixed travel distance, but for those the “movement” portion is only secondary. Skills like Maul, Void Cleave, Lethal Mirage)
You can modify the travel distance of both Shift and Surge both ways (less/more distance traveled). So you can adjust them to your build/liking. It’s not that all of the sudden the skill you are using is travelign an unknown distance. It’s all in the players hand to maneuver and avoid telegraphs.
Making them target the cursor will give those skills a very different feeling, more in line with all the other movement skills, and that’s what I personally would like to avoid.
One of my favorite games of all time (Marvel Heroes) managed to make the movement skill of every of their 60+ heroes to feel very different and distinct.
I would like the same for LE. If LE will implement more movement skills in the future (probably with shared cooldown with the existing movement skills) I hope they will come up with more interesting mechanics.
Thank you for sharing this invaluable information. It is very important for me to know what you like and what you want
I’m also very happy that my character’s only moving skill is special, and it moves where he wants, not me.
I also really like spending a skill point to increase the distance, which is bad for me, and increase the cooldown time, which is bad for me, to take the node I need. Truly the most epic skill point investment ever.
I am not sure why the sarcasm meter went from 0 to 100 within one post.
If you disagree with me, just disagree, I have a thick hide
If you reach certain threshold, where one shift is enough to avoid a particular telegraph, without the need of any further movement, the increased cooldown really doesn’t matter that much.
Shift will become less flexible to use all the time for small things, because of the cooldown, but it becoems way stronger in other situatiosn, where one shift would not be enough and you still need ot move for a fraction of a second after shiting.
It all depends on what your particular builds is.
It doesn’t move where “it” wants, you are in 100% control of the direction, only the distance is fixed.
And once you get good at using the skill, you can predict/control where the skill exactly goes.
It makes gameplay way more engaging.
That’s a fair point. There is a “Tooltip Hunt” section on Discord, where we can put all elements like this. It can be a typo, it can be something badly described, etc. The devs do use that to correct and improve the game.
Or, as @Llama8 reminds us, there is the Bug section of the forum.
All i hear is whining because you refuse to properly use your shift, aiming aimlessly.
Shift dont teleport you into mobs, you yourself did. Your mouse dont magically point at mobs when u use shift.
The situation i think you can have a problem is when you are spamming shift on cool down to keep the buff up and inadvertently a pack of mobs is in your way.
I dont have a problem with it and its my rogue’s bread and butter.
Im curious also since you are talking 1000 corruption, a video at that level should explain things more clearly how you are actually using shift.
There are objects in the game through which the projectiles pass without problems. This applies to all projectiles, including mobs, which can safely shoot at the player through the walls.
The situation in which Shift is extremely annoying with its mechanics is simple. When half of the arena with the boss is filled with all sorts of pools, rays and projectiles, and at the same time the boss has a + 2500% damage modifier, it becomes very important to move to the right point, and not in the right direction.
Actually, because of this limitation, I use Shift only in order to move faster on the map now.
I have not recorded the gameplay for 1000+, but I have it for 900+:
And just to understand how unimportant it is that 400+ corruption is happening:
Not sure that changing a skill for 900+ corruption level of play is entirely a good idea… You are obviously playing an outlier build and i doubt very much that 99% of players are going to get to this level of scaled difficulty… Changing things based on outlier situations that almost no-one is going to experience is never a good idea.
I watched your 913 corruption but I couldnt actually see what the problem was… You seem to be playing fine and rushing through maps, doing damage and completing the levels fine… I do not understand the problem - you are achieving stratospheric levels with the build…Honestly dont understand… I get the feeling that what you are wanting is a different movement skill entirely… The devs designed Shift in the way that it is right now as part of the Rogue concept and your request, even if there is some merit in it, really doesnt make sense to me… You are using it and doing extremely well… what would the point of changing the skill be? To push another 500 corruption? What for?
True, thats why i asked “Is there a small chance that skills such as Rogues “Shift” will be used at the targeted location,”
In that build in the video, several skills are tied to Shift, it turned out to be a rather interesting combination.
But when it comes to oneshoot or not - Shift just can’t be used.
And so a more trivial build becomes more efficient.
As a result, the fight with Julia (for example) turns into a hit with one skill. Which in my opinion is not very good for the game as a whole.
I respect the work of streamers and YouTubers.
But they don’t have the opportunity to check their builds for high corruption, they need to release content often, and not do one build for 2 months.
At the same time, the statements “slightly improve the gear, and the build can do 500+” annoy me, because this is not true.
The game at a high level sometimes changes diametrically opposite.
I got to 1000+ just to see how the game would change. For example, the Glancing Blow mechanics have almost lost their relevance, although at 400+ it makes Rogue immortal)
I think, it is what it is. The infinite scaling system is supposed to kill any build a a certain point. In your example it is the shift mechanic. But with the same logic you could also say that at 1000+ corruption the defensive layer scaling is bad because you get oneshot.
When you drive too fast and your car drifts out of the road in a curve you also can’t complain about the road having too tight curves.
At 1000+ corruption every build propably has some weak spots that make it hard to go on. But that’s a problem for posers only (no offence, dude!).
When we are designing a skill, we look at several axis. With movement skills, it’s a little tricky because the primary function of all of them is identical and pretty simple, move quickly. We like skills to be as unique as possible and reflect thematically on the class using them.
A really clear example of this is wolves vs skeletons. They are both “foot soldier” style minions but one can get far more, has less health, is often used as a resource and the other can buff each other and can be restored when downed. We take the themes from both classes and apply them mechanically to the skills to make them distinct from each other.
This is the same when it comes to movement skills, it’s just a little less clear sometimes. A good example is the distinction between teleport and transplant. The skills are extremely similar, the biggest difference right off the bat is one costs mana and the other costs health.
Movement abilities don’t have a lot of ways to be made mechanically unique from each other in super meaningful ways but when you string them together it can work well. Cooldown, targeting type, fixed distance or variable, channeled or cast, use cost, speed, damage and secondary effects are most of what we have to work with. In order to build the fantasy for rogue, we wanted the primary movement ability to be very agile. Short burst movement that allows for frequent use and to weave in other abilities. Giving it the ability to pick any target location makes it a shorter max range teleport with huge upsides in almost every other category.
So, part of what keeps shift unique and balanced is that it has a fixed distance that it moves. Part of the learned mechanics with using a rogue is internalizing how far shift will take you and being able to use it consistently at the right moment to get to where you want to go.
I just wanted to give a little insight into how we created the skill and why it is the way it is. We also did test it with a variable dash distance in the initial design stage and we didn’t like the result. We are really happy with the way shift plays and feels so it’s unlikely that we will change it. That doesn’t mean it’s impossible though and I really appreciate the detailed feedback with references that you’ve provided.
Yes, Rogue absolutely needs a backstab type move, though the devs did say that front/back doesn’t really exist as a concept so “proper” backstabs are unlikely to work.
Though to be fair, they said the same about +skills, so maybe it’s just one of those things that’s impossible until it isn’t.
(no offence, dude!).