Let's Talk about Class Diversity

Discord gives me literally 0 search results when I copy and paste that in.

And that was his response when I actually asked him on dev stream a year or so ago.

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Don’t copy/paste. Type it in. It will match Mike’s EHG discord handle with his discord account, which is “the_madd_hatter”

Also, no quotation marks, obv

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I took it into my own hands, that was the last response on this:

(i hope that’s okay @EHG_Mike - if not i’ll delete the post / link of that).
Though that response reads on both sides correctly. We might potentially get an new base in the future, but before that due simpler implementations new masteries first^^

/Edit: And yeah your second suggestion for looking it up worked better, you need to have the ‘person’ locked in and than you can search it’s context like mastery, but first suggestion didn’t work for me either…

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Yeah, find it that way as well … once I translated the “from” the language I have Discord installed in.

Was not aware there was an official “plan” for either, only knew his last response I heard was that masteries were (in his personal opinion, as I recall) harder to implement balance-wise, because it adds something to 3 other masteries as well.

Maybe they just gotten better at it since then or maybe a new class is just thematically harder to design than a Mastery. It’s not like he got a lot of time to mull it over during dev stream, after all.

So I guess if the current stance is Masteries are more likely / vaguely planned, then I’ll have just updated my knowledge.

There is a solution, merge elemental damages together into a single defensive resist type and then create two more and shift the animations and stats damage type. Its not a lot of work and will keep the classes unique.

Im sorry but after playing mage i can clearly say that shaman is a slower mage.

I wouldn’t say that storm totems or earthquake have any similarity with a mage.
Sure, there’s overlap… but with simple damage type overlap we can create an equivalent between a lot of classes, the respective skills make a huge portion of why those are unique.

The Shaman is clearly made to harness nature’s elements for the builds, the Sorcerer (I guess you’re talking about?) is rather clearly focused on ‘classic’ spells of some sort, Black Hole being a wildcard there.

Dodge can be harnesses surprisingly well by other classes too. The one major defensive mechanic otherwise barely accessible would be Glancing Blows. But I get the gist.

I can agree that some reworks are necessary there, especially in terms of stun avoidance. That affix is a trap simply.
Beyond that I can’t agree though. Neither with the auto attacks nor with the enemy herding. It directly tells you not to do that by having stuns, making the chance of being overwhelmed and hence stunned high.

Condensing them? No thanks.
Also ‘chaos’ damage is the void in LE. So we have that basically. The gods are depicted as powerful but not infallible, hence no celestial one. Light is an interesting take though.

That’s a nice idea. Uniques of such kinds are always welcome, making otherwise not really viable options interesting.

Hearing that for the first time.

Glancing blows is extremely powerful, wars is too, 100% block is a game changer as well with investment.
If they become stronger it turns into being fairly ridiculous.

Besides it being a useless stat with the low amount of mana characters have… it wouldn’t do much there. If you haven’t handled stun then trying to achieve that through a mana shield is the last place you should think about doing it in the first place.

Mostly uninformed, which is utterly okay, after all you learn stuff by doing things or well… informing yourself.

This line of argumentation is a generalization.

Obviously feelings matter! Mostly in terms of presentation. Secondary in terms of market positioning to draw a large crowd. They got the later down to the dot clearly, now it only matters about perception hence.

No… no it’s absolutely not. Proper research is. It has exactly ‘zero’ to do with game design. The only feelings you got to put into your game are your creativity and your effort, beyond that it can be very very detrimental actually.

Why?

Is there? I actually didn’t know. What’s happening with the idol resists?

Yes, I agree with that, they need to adjust a bit for the Primalist in general. It’s in a bit of a bad place since it’s rather dated in design.
Has nothing to do with ‘encroaching’ towards the mage but rather with the overall setup of the whole archetype.

Hard disagree. It’s a very liked playstyle both in LE as it is in PoE and also some other ARPGs which offer static placements of any sort.

Ok, thanks… that comment made my day! :rofl:

What do you mean with ‘efficiently’? If I wanna make a Earthquake, Tornado or Avalanche Shaman it’s entirely possible and fine.

If you stop with this singular sentence and instead provide direct examples we can start actually talking about it rather then going ‘I believe not!’ versus ‘I believe it does!’.
It’s your job as the one seeing an issue to make it visible, saying ‘it is an issue’ is not always enough… actually rarely.

You aren’t though.

Exactly what I love about the class as well! It’s such a great and sadly all too rare setup to see nowadays. Harnessing the powers of nature in some way rather then the spiritual stuff most go with by now. As if a shaman was generally some bogus-man rather then someone with knowledge about weather patterns and natural cycles…

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I want to play with whatever skill or build is fun for me. Last epoch disappointed me in this regard. Some builds are extremely powerful and there are some builds whose synergy with each other is extremely OP, for example Frostclaw with elemental nova or explosive trap with ballista or warlock fissure combinations. Why do I need to play with meta builds in order to play in high corruption levels?

Most of the meta skills have powerful unique items. As if that wasn’t enough, they also have powerful idols. With skills that are not played much, you only have to play with exalted items or crappy uniques.

I’m not someone who likes to play with meta builds. But whenever I want to play with my own builds, when I realize that my damage is insufficient, the game inevitably encourages me to add powerful skills to my build. For example, I tried to do something falconer with poison acid flask, my build was weak and I tried another build. As another example, I made a shattering strike build, but I didn’t want to use mana strike. Even though I invsted full mana regen, the build encouraged me to add mana strike and play the classic Shatterin Strike build, which everyone plays.

Although the skill tree mechanics are nice, it offers the player a limited choice. What more can the developers do? You can say that skill can be playable as both melee, range, hit and spell, but only few options are strong others are weak. To give an example. Who played as a caster with the help of staff with the gathering storm skill? I played and saw it and it is very weak. They added it just because we added gameplay variety. It cannot be combined with another skill, unique item or idol. Likewise, you cannot make a powerful combination with the healing hands skyfall node. Unfortunately, most of the skills of the Paladin character are integrated with smite. If you want to commit high corruption, you have to do something with smite…

I excuse these because the game is new, but there are a lot of things that need to change.

Always happy to please :stuck_out_tongue:

That sentence is self-explanatory though, isn’t it?

As for ‘why does the situation even exist’ it’s because EHG is fairly bad with balancing. Actually those meta builds shouldn’t even remotely be able to reach as far as they do… including some non-meta builds even.

I also recommend playing what you enjoy mechanically and not going for efficiency, focus on fun.

Huh? Which ones?
There’s surprisingly few builds which don’t go with % health/health idols.
Exceptions apply.

So… let me get this straight, I think I’m failing to understand there.

You don’t want to play meta-builds (hence the automatically strongest builds, which meta is)
But you don’t want to play builds which aren’t as strong as meta-builds.

Those two are inherent opposites though? It’s an impossibility what you’re describing by definition, so I don’t know what you exactly want to say there.

That’s because acid flask is fairly underperforming in general, has nothing to do with the falconer itself which is vastly overperforming.

Also from your paragraph there… you’re actively diverging from combinations which are inherently made to work together while wondering why they don’t synergize as well as the specifically for that situation made solutions… what do you expect?

Yes, that’s inherently depending on the amount of content.
Which means more classes and masteries for the future and more skills for each class to tinker and combine with.

It’s currently a 1.0, the amount of available options is surprisingly solid. One of the absolute best out there for that genre actually in such an early state. No, D4 as an AAA title doesn’t count, their baseline funding is just on another different level then EHG could ever have reasonably… and D4 screwed it up nonetheless.

1.1 will be an endgame update… and hopefully a balancing update as well bringing a few things gradually in line.

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Considering the name - you sir make very relevant points :+1:

Totally agree :+1:

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