Lagon in leveling has killed the game for me

[Psojed]

@Airowird

And no, easier to see doesn’t mean easier to avoid.

It absolutely does. Especially for a new player.

@Airowird

A non-perfect player may still get hit by Majasa’s attack, which hurts a lot if you’re not properly geared.

As showcased in the video.

@Airowird

Stone Gaze, one of her more lethal attacks (atleast for new players, imho) isn’t just a hit or miss thing either, but stacks, so a slower player can still get out of it or recover straight after.

Stone Gaze is very obviously non-lethal. The only incoming damage is weak Physical DoT. And guess which resistance type I recommended for the fight?

@Airowird

She also has a bit more random damage going out during her first phase, even compared to Lagon in phase 2. If I die to her, it’s usually just overall damage intake rather than not avoiding a single hit. Even her last phase just builds up damage & armor shred rather than just getting you from full to null. Compared to your facetank vid where Lagon’s eye beam still nearly kills you half the time…

Not sure what are you trying to say here
When you die, it’s because you keep taking chip damage until you die. And you’re comparing it to me, who’s taking bigger hits from Lagon’s beam? In other words, you’re trying to say that Lagon is more dangerous than Majasa - just like I said?

@Airowird

He attacks like once every 4 seconds. You definitely get a few shots in between each attack. And yes, you do so much damage to Majasa when she’s burrowed …

Plus her stone gaze is always aimed at you, so saying that gives you free time would be the same as Lagon’s moonbeam or melee slams giving you time.

When I say the boss constantly gives you free time, it means literally that. The boss is not attacking you during the Stone Gaze. She stuns you, then waits for the stun to fall off. Not attacking you during the burrowing. Not attacking you during her regeneration. You are given windows of time constantly throughout the fight. Unlike Lagon.

I never said anything about you attacking the boss, but yes, I can attack during the moonbeam too.

@Airowird

You definitely can avoid the waves on Lagon.

I’d love to see that

@Airowird

Yes, he avoids rather than gears, and pretty sure Lightning Aegis saves his bacon as much as Ward does, but the fact he spent 30 tries (at up to 5min each, that’s atleast 2 hours) of learning the fight means it’s not just a roflstomp.

I didn’t say anything about roflstomping the boss. I even stated “his DPS is weak so the fight lasts for 6 minutes”. I’m starting to think you’re not clear on the meaning of a “gear check”.

A gear check is a straightforward fight, where the boss has high DPS output you cannot avoid, and usually the fight is timed - enrage, instakill mechanic, stacking damage buff on the boss, something like that. It’s designed so you literally cannot beat the fight without a certain level of gear - hence the name.

In a gear check, you don’t need to spend hours learning how to avoid mechanics. You must have a certain DPS output. You cannot avoid taking damage. And you need to finish it quickly.

I posted his video as a clear showcase of Majasa NOT being a gear check.

@Airowird

But considering he called Majasa challenging after doing Lagon, that would counter the initial argument of Lagon being the hardest boss for a new player, no?

The idea that Lagon’s difficulty is above Majasa isn’t based on random player’s opinions.

@Airowird

Regardless, I think more players (especially the non-streamer/tuber ones) have issues with Lagon because his attacks come from several different directions. e.g. in phase 3 you have to keep track of his eye, his arms, the waves, and now also the tentacles, which are the only thing on the screen you’re actually aiming at. Compared to Majasa you’re only ever looking at her for telegraphs, and the only time that changes you get 3 crystal turrets just machine gunning their ‘basic’ attack, no telegraphs to be had.

Then why would you say Majasa is a bigger gear check than Lagon You said her fight is simpler, her damage is less spiky. Add that her attacks are avoidable, and that you can fight her for prolonged periods of time, and it’s pretty clear.

@Airowird

I can’t even think of another boss before that, where damage is coming from another source, except the eye beam adds on Emperor’s Husk, and I’m sure plenty of players get caught out on that one for their first play-throughs as well. And it’s still slightly better because they are attackable enemies moving in before starting their attack, and it’s reasonable to expect something with a red bar over their head is going to damage you.

The tentacle is damaging you If you stand close enough.

But yeah, that’s basically why we call it a skill issue, ppl just couldn’t adapt to damage coming from the sides and that’s about it.

[Airowird]

@Psojed

The idea that Lagon’s difficulty is above Majasa isn’t based on random player’s opinions.

You’re aware that to the rest of the internet, you are a random player, right?

[Psojed]

You’re aware that I’m providing proofs and showcases of the things I talk about, right?

[Airowird]

And I was showcasing that some people seem to find Majasa the more difficult boss, someone who you brought into the thread as “proof”, btw.

But if you’re convinced the waves on Lagon are unavoidable, then yeah, he’s definitely going to be a more difficult boss for your playstyle, you know, the “instead of learning the fight, just facetank everything!” one. But that doesn’t mean he’s either designed to be more difficult, or actually is for the average player. He just happens to be the first boss you need to look out for more than 1 move for.

And Majasa can be less spiky and easier to see coming, but have (for example) less reaction time to avoid things, or just more overall melee damage to whittle you down, meaning it takes longer to recover from mistakes than on Lagon. Which would make the fight both simpler to learn, yet harder to execute.

But you know what, fuck it, let’s say Lagon is the hardest boss, just for arguments sake.

Atleast I’m actually trying to understand why people claim he’s such a difficulty spike, rather than just telling them that “they’re doing it wrong, just do what I do!” (namely overgear it) Because if you don’t understand why people have an issue with it, how are you going to ever fix it? (Or not make another boss like that again)

[valingt]

so its not that i cant do the fight. its that the boss fights up to him are kinda simple. was talking to a friend and we came to the point of why do the story line bosses need to have all the same mechanics as the mono ones. why cant you just remove some of them and then make the mono ones have more and the 100c+ ones have all of them. why not add layers to make us keep wanting to improve the gear and think we can do it on any build. i have builds that can kill him with no issues and others that just keep getting 1 shot. it has more to do with to many things going on as your leveling with crap gear. some will call it hand holding and what not but lets be honest if we want a game that is just a slap in the face all the time we play POE. if we want relaxed we play D4. this should not be like POE or like D4. make the middle ground. yes i know i can spend more time and just get better gear or level up more but i feel as if the boss is a 54 and im a 55 it should be doable with out wiping 10+ times to do it. if i feel my time is being waisted then i just dont play the game or spend money one it. " Time is Money My Friend "

[Airowird]

Out of curiosity, which ability would you remove from current campaign Lagon and why?

For sake of the argument, let’s ignore that the waves in monoliths already spawn more often.

[Psojed]

You didn’t showcase anything.

The quote is as follows: “This boss proved to be a challenge for me”. It’s written in the description of the Majasa video that I linked. The statement “X was challenging” does not mean “X was more challenging than Y” in any way.

So basically you found a new player’s opinion, misrepresented the meaning, and now you’re trying to use it as an argument for a hoax. Great showcase indeed

@Airowird

Atleast I’m actually trying to understand why people claim he’s such a difficulty spike

If you really want to understand why people claim Lagon is a difficulty spike, you can go watch some actual players play the game. There are playthroughs on youtube and twitch you can watch.

But that requires that you first start reading and hearing what others actually say and write instead of adding your own meanings.

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@Airowird

But if you’re convinced the waves on Lagon are unavoidable

I believe I said “I’d love to see that”.
In case you think that means someone is “convinced” then sure

@Airowird

he’s definitely going to be a more difficult boss for your playstyle, you know, the “instead of learning the fight, just facetank everything!” one.

Let’s see if I got this right.
The fight is more difficult to my playstyle where I can stand still and deal damage without worries, and it is less difficult to other playstyles who need to avoid mechanics.

@Airowird

And Majasa can be less spiky and easier to see coming, but have (for example) less reaction time to avoid things, or just more overall melee damage to whittle you down, meaning it takes longer to recover from mistakes than on Lagon. Which would make the fight both simpler to learn, yet harder to execute.

Or you can just build some sustain from vendor gear - like I did and like everyone is supposed to - and forget about all this nonsense.

@Airowird

rather than just telling them that “they’re doing it wrong, just do what I do!” (namely overgear it)

I already explained the concept behind my Lagon kill video, but I’ll make an exception and explain it to you one more time.
I downgraded my gear to items bought from vendors, and then went to facetank Lagon.
Hope this helps.

[Airowird]

I was gonna reply to that all, but then I noticed …

You literally stated the waves are unavoidable in an earlier comment and then use a phrase that’s commonly used in a sarcastic manner as a response to when you were told otherwise. Either you’re trying some gotcha moment, you forgot what you wrote yourself or you simply don’t know enough about adult conversations to know what you wrote is generally read as sarcasm. Or you genuinely never actually tried to dodge them before, nor took the effort today, but still feel confident enough to tell others what the best tactics on Lagon are.

None of those give me the confidence that this conversation with you is going to contribute to any meaningful change, so here are some back for you.

See you next year.

[Psojed]

Sadly even after you decided to not reply “to that all”, you still replied, and it didn’t go well…

I said this:

@Psojed

IIRC Majasa’s melee hits in P2 and Lagon’s Waves in P2/3 are the only things you can’t avoid. Everything else is avoidable.

IIRC means “If I recall correctly / If I remember correctly” and is commonly used when someone is guessing from memory - in other words, when someone doesn’t know for sure.

If you read “I don’t know for sure” and the next reply “I’d love to see that” and interpret them as “he’s convinced about it”, I’d say you have some kind of comprehension issue. Or you’re doing it on purpose, misrepresenting the meaning of my words for whatever reason - like you did with the youtuber’s statement

But even if you assign your own meanings to the words of others, it doesn’t matter to me. The readers can read the discussion and make their own conclusions about it.

[WeAreViledNation]

Speculative i had less views on how to beat Majasa then lagon guides. Which probably is evidence suggeating Lagon is harder.

Lagon either filters you, or you beat it. If you can beat it, you probably already have decent gear, or you have the skill to beat him naked after a 40 min slog. Majasa has only one mechanic check and that is her heal. But if you can dps more then she heals you will win eventually. Majasa phase 1 is arguably harder

[Psojed]

As we already told you, don’t look at views.

@Psojed

Views and traffic doesn’t say anything about how many of them are real people, how many of those people are LE players, how many of those views are rewatches, how many people were searching for X or the reasons why they are looking for X.

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@WeAreViledNation

If you can beat it, you probably already have decent gear, or you have the skill to beat him naked after a 40 min slog.

Or you use the third option and use the safespot as we mentioned several times already.

@WeAreViledNation

Majasa has only one mechanic check and that is her heal. But if you can dps more then she heals you will win eventually.

Majasa’s heals aren’t a check of any kind. She heals exactly twice in P2, because there are two sarcophagi. Then she doesn’t heal anymore.