Dungeon Keys Not Dropping (post 0.8.5b)

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Hi, I wanted to share my experience with dungeon keys not dropping in the hope that this can be addressed by the dev team. I have played this patch roughly 10 or so hours (about half that has been with the new 0.8.5b patch today) since it launched and I have only received one dungeon key which was for temporal sanctum. This means that I have not been able to engage with the new content and that accessing an entire chunk of the endgame is based on really poor RNG.

When the first dungeon launched I received keys at a pretty decent rate. At worst it was once an hour and even that felt fine. I’m super bummed about this because I love this game and I think it’s going to be really incredible when it launches. This is first time I’ve ever felt like the game is doing something that really isn’t working very well.

Having an complete endgame system locked behind this type of RNG can be very frustrating. I would at least like to see them add dungeon keys as a reward type from monoliths so that even if you are having terrible RNG you still have a guaranteed path to getting a key.

I don’t know if anyone is having this type of experience after today’s patch, I’ve even gone as far as thinking maybe I should just make a new account because something is wrong with my current one because something just feels really off about this. I understand that you can have bad RNG but 1 key in over 10 hours goes way beyond that. I hope this can be addressed during this patch cycle as I really want to run the new dungeons and see all the cool new features the team worked so hard on to implement. Thanks for reading!

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Same thing for me - Temporal Sanctum keys are fine. New ones - non-existent.

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RNG is RNG.

I received 4 keys for the new dungeon as random drops within the first 50 minutes of playing 085b.

I literally asked the devs on discord if they also increased the random drop rates for dungeon key.

They did not change random drop rates at all. So it’s still the same as 085.

But MoF Bosses drop all 3 dungeon Keys now as expected. You sometimes even drop 2 dungeon Keys from MoF bosses.

One thing to note here, %Inc. Item rarity does affect how likely a boss drops dungeons keys, so try doing boss fights with a couple of enemy modifiers active.

MoF bosses are a very reliable source of keys outside of random drops.
The random drops are still very RNG, which is ok IMO.

Another thing to note here: I would absolutely dislike a situation, where you have way to many keys to use all of them.
I much rather have a very rewarding dungeon, that has very restricted access, but with extraordinary rewards.

Sitting on dozens of dungeons keys, not having any motivation to do them is much more undesired for me personally.

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So, still broken. We shouldn’t be getting 10 Temporal Sanctum keys in a row and none of the new keys. That kind of streak indicates a RNG bug.

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Imagine gating the new patch content, behind RNG, that clearly isnt working as intended, since the hotfix I have ran over 100 echoes, 2 keys in return.!!, not from bosses either, from random drops. Rather than want to keep playing, I just cannot be arsed playing.

What a great way to waste mine and others time.

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Whats wrong by having access to game content at will?

You clearly get presented the opinion of players that have bad luck (or maybe there still is a bug?) that it feels very bad for them. Stating “rng is rng” is not doing anything to make it feel better.

Just to remind you: A few days before you ranted on a different platform about how bad it is to not be able to get keys.

Maybe for you everything is fine now because you can log onto your 300 corruption Harvest Lich and just farm Bosses for 8 hours a day. But for other people that have their first character and not juiced up monoliths, it’s harder to get keys within their daily 3 hour play session.

I’d say it’s really sad that people since release of 0.8.5 didn’t have a chance to get to play the new content.

Why not have the chest full of keys so you can play the content you want when you want? I don’t get why it should be a good thing to gate content behind rng.

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I actually kinda agree, but then you have to ask the question “why have keys at all” and tbh, I feel like thats sorta a good question im asking myself now.

I guess the reason is so you cant story skip in the future where we have “seasons” that way you still have to do the first initial play through.

All of the dungeons other then the soul gambler which I have not gotten a key for yet as far as I know require you have some other resource, gold, legendaries, etc. I guess you can argue that if you had unlimited access to sanctum you could spend 50 hours farming for high LP julra legendaries but uhhh more power to you tbh.

I think if anything we just need a bump to drops from other content then bosses.

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Restricted content is something LE needs right now.

Obviously the reward for doing such content needs to match the rarity of the key (or what ever ressource you need to access it).
I am not saying that making content harder accessible makes it automatically better.

But LE currently is missing very rewarding content.

And the easiest way to balance making content very lucrative is to give it restricted access in some form or another.
Soulfire Bastion is one of the best things happened to LE over the last few patches.
It is not perfect yet, but its already a very different kind of content, that is not freely available and were clearing mobs actually is imapctful and meaningful.

LE basically makes all of its content accesseable very easily compared to other similar games with things like Normal/Empowered Versions of the same content and T1-T4 dungeon, which are basically the same in terms of “content”.
There are big portions of other games a lot of players are not able to access.

If people want freely accessable content, by all means go a head, but that way it needs to also be not as rewarding.

A possible solution for this might be giving free access to T1, T 2 and maybe T3?
And then Gate T3 or at least T4 behind a ressource and makes those tiers extremely valuable.
But with this system the whole dungeon skip for successive characters wouldn’t work.

But this is a whole other discussion, I will soon get some feedback out in a dedicated thread.

PS:

There a big difference between having content that should drop certain ressources not drop it due to a bug and having drop rates that you are not happy with.
The “rant” that I did was not even focused at the dungeons keys primarily.

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It doesn’t matter why something is not dropping. For some people it’s currently the same as for you some days ago, so I would’ve expected you could empathize with them.

Yes. And that’s obviously because LE wants to do things better than these other games you’re referring to.

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I suppose if your a 12 hour a day, notepadder main, its fine, where as the player who can only play 2 or 3hrs a day its not fine.

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Damn… thats crappy RNG… before patch b, I only found 1 Light and 4 or so Soulfires… after the b patch I got Light Abour or Soulfire keys with every mono boss and a few more from general echo drops in 200-350 corruption…

Havent done any campaign or non-empowered monos to gauge how bad it is there, but I expect that the keys are probably too rare right now…

I believe that content should have some sort of an entry pass to make it more of a chase but something is not right with the way that LE is going about it right now…

The thing I dont understand regarding the rarity of the keys is the fact that all Dungeons have a secondary requirement - i.e. Light needs gold (and a lot of it), Soul needs to collect the soul thingies (the most i have collected is ~900), Sanctum needs a unique PLUS an exalted (we all know how hard that is to find good ones)…

So why do the keys need to be so rare? Dungeons are double gated. and thats not even considering the difficulty of the dungeon bosses as a possible third gate at higher levels.

?

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It absolutely matters why something is dropping or not.
Because the expectations are way different.

I was not annoyed by “how rare” the key was, but by the time I spend into something, where I expected to receive some keys.

It has nothing to do with how much you play or not, we had a couple of simialr discussions about such things.
And there are even “casual players”, that have minimal playtime, that enjoy sytems that don’t give you free access to certain things, or that make you invest more time into certain things (Like Mastery respec vs. levleing a new char, or cathcing up exp after respecing etc.)

This is very similar even though not exactly the same. But the argument that this only is something for player with extraordinary playtime isn’t really somethign that is applicable.

I want to emphasize here what I said earlier:

Right now, what makes this whole situation a bit worse, is that “all this new shiny content” wants to be played immediately by a lot of players.

But if you look at it in the grand scheme of the game, its fine.
When you play a character regularly you will eventually drop keys for all these dungeons.

It only becomes a problem if you desperately wants a specific key and are very unlucky.

When you do not play on a character that already has completed everything, its very likely that you will receive a coupel of keys before you finish your “main progress” with blessings and gear etc.

But Soulfire Bastion is not “double gated”.

Soul Embers drop within the dungeon itself and only count for one dungeon run, so a Soulfire Bastion run is self-contained with no external ressource required outside of the key.

The other 2 dungeons do need external ressources and having keys for them certainly feels stupid at some point.
Even with a rarity from Patch 085, with bugged drops from MoF bosses, so only random drops are a source, you will still always have more keys than you could potentailly run Arbor and Sanctum, unlesss you only runn them for the 1st and 2nd Floot to farm exalted items.

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Erm… no? Imagine somebody plays monos and doesn’t get a key because of bad rng. It’s totally the same than somebody playing mo is and not getting a key because if a bug. Both people expect to get a key by playing the content, but they don’t. And that feels bad for both.

Just you are searching for arguments to proof theres a difference. Because for you it’s fine now. You get your keys reliably. But there is not only you in this community. And not every single discussion here in this forum has to be approved by you if it is valid feedback or not.

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Some thoughts I had:

One of the problems that I’ve consistently seen across discord and the forum here are statements about the new content in the new patch and how it “feels bad” (said in many different ways) about the key drop rate – pre and post bugfix.

I think a lot of people are forgetting the context of this patch, and are viewing it akin to a “League” (Cycle in LE). But it most certainly is not that – this is just another patch of development by EHG on the road towards a releasable game with content at all different levels of difficulty and complexity. After looking at the patch notes, I think what could help with reactions like this is some context from EHG about what the intent is for a particular piece of content. For any particular piece of new content, is it meant to be something someone should be able to expect to use reliably for “good, better, best” rewards? What kind of investment is intended to be required to enter into that content?

I think that a lot of people probably looked at the level requirements for a dungeon and tried to extrapolate contextual information similar to what I listed above and came to erroneous conclusions.

This kind of information could perhaps help community members contextualize their reactions and allow for better feedback in general.

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keys aren’t dropping at somewhat acceptable droprates, even after solely farming the monolith including timeline bosses, and it’s just bad. It’s not a matter of bad RNG, it’s a matter of bad design. There’s no reason for this game to keep people out of dungeons, especially the new ones, which is basically the only new playable content in the patch. I don’t understand it either, it’s not just you, it’s a lot of people, but they’re not all on the forum, and this simply does not feel good. Hope it gets fixed.

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Have to agree. I have played something like 30h after 0.8.5 drop out. I have had 6 soulfire bastion, 6 lightless arbor, and only 2 temporal sanctum keys. This from monoliths and monolith bosses.

I don’t know. Maybe only way to get more keys is to do new arena more.

I think the key rate should be something like one key every second monolith or something to keep playing interesting.

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I’m sorry to see people are having a similar experience by not getting keys but I am also glad to see that feedback coming in so hopefully EHG will make some changes.

I also wanted to respond to a couple of things here. First, I don’t think that keys should be a ubiquitous item. It should definitely feel cool when they drop but not feel like a relief. There is a big difference between “hey awesome I got a key” and “ok I finally got a key and can go do the dungeon one time”. I’m not in favor of approaching this like a POE league either, where the keys are a seasonal mechanic so they are available in every area in the game. The dungeons are very powerful, especially temporal sanctum with the right items so it makes sense to me that you have to grind a little bit for keys.

That being said, going a couple of hours or more without seeing a key it just too much to me. Also grinding out a monolith boss with the hopes that they will drop a key is also too much in my opinion, especially empowered ones. Monolith bosses should basically have a 100% chance to drop a key, that way there is at least some protection against bad RNG from running monoliths, that and making them a reward from monoliths themselves.

I think there is a definitely a happy medium that can be found here. A quick update on my key drops though: I have been playing quite a bit lately and I have just now got my first lightless arbor key. I have gotten a handful of temporal sanctum and soul bastion but again when I get a key I feel relief more than anything and that’s not a fun feeling to regularly have in a game.

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