The infinite scaling is the bane of modern ARPGs

General
62

That’s not true. With the introduction of Eldar/Uber-Eldar the common Tier was T15 to farm in, has always been.

With the intorduction of Sirus (and the 4 Conquerors hence) it changed over to T16.

In the current stage we got T17 as content which is supposed to be between uber-tier and normal boss-tier… which entirely failed balance-wise as it’s harder to beat then uber-bosses for a large swath of builds :stuck_out_tongue:

Oh? Not really?
The current state of PoE 1 is that there’s never been a better position for how many builds are viable and comfortable to progress ever before. It’s actually hard to find a non-viable build currently, nigh everything works for something.

Yes, not everything works for all content… but that’s also not GGG’s goal, it is EHG’s though and hence they get judged accordingly.

Because no matter how complex a tree is… if you follow optimized build guides it doesn’t matter which game you play, it’s always better :slight_smile:

That’s why they’re optimized, since you can’t perfectly balance in the first place. Some stuff will always be better. The goal isn’t to avoid that, it’s to provide a large as possible amount of builds in a specific spectrum and avoid having core builds over- or underperform from this spectrum.

Then don’t do it and use em for guidance when you start to get at your limits, to learn rather then to copy.

It’s not an ‘all or nothing’ with build guides, they can be used for building a knowledge in character building too. Ignoring their existence is not the way to go though, it’s basically impossible to create a in-depth complex game while also expecting that the intricacies of said system will be inherently understood by people. You either explain it very in-depth in-game (looter ARPGs are really really bad with that, dunno why it’s such a prevalent problem for devs to include that properly) or you follow external sources to get said knowledge.

And that’s fair, more then fair.

I can heavily recommend ‘Dwarven Realms’ for the overall feeling. It provides the core feeling of the genre, has some interesting bosses (with more being provided steadily over time) and doesn’t enforce the in-depth knowledge of the system like diablo-likes do.

Because of the presentation. Content for content’s sake is fine… but without reward the value psychologically is not as big as it otherwise could be. And many many people come to those types of games to get success where it’s in reality often missing for whatever reason. And how people perceive said success is quite different depending on their personality and circumstances.

Agreed with that :slight_smile: Absolutely.

DO so! I can heavily recommend it. It’s a prime example of ‘ARPG done right’ simply. The design is phenomenal in total.

And that’s what it boils down to… live-service, the bane of modern gaming. The disaster system as to why ‘mediocre slob’ needs to be presented the majority of the time rather then qualitative top-end content which is just fun and not solely built around retention time (for survival… because it boils down for live-service games to survival).

63

:roll_eyes:

Businesses that make things try really hard to make the things that consumers want.

The elite, the aesthetes, try really hard to shape the definition of art based upon ego and their own personal taste. The hoi polloi spend the money that actually matters to the businesses that create things.

I stopped playing Valheim because I got tired of us (group of friends) all having our own realms that we had decide where to play and none of us could be arsed to rent a server somewhere. I’m awaiting a survival/builder that allows me to play with friends in the same world, free of the dirty rando.

I played the hell out of elden ring, wishing that it had better multiplayer, and also wishing there were no reds. I stopped because it felt so lonely.

There is a continuum from, ‘all alone’ to ‘with everyone’ that game companies dabble with and will continue to dabble with, because the tastes of the masses are not a mono-block and are also a moving target.

Last thing to add; I really like that Valheim has put so much effort into allowing the player-host options in how their world operates. It allllmost makes me want to rent a server.

I wouldn’t mind the return of a subscription if I was the one that could dictate whether affixes are auto-collected or not (along with a bunch of other options). Developers make bad decisions every day. And then cling to them due to ego.

2 Likes
64

I’m confused. Where does “I don’t want to rent a server” (that your friends can chip in to pay for) end and “I wouldn’t mind the return of a subscription” begin? To me those are the same thing, albeit one is paid to a hosting company & the other to the devs, but you the player is still paying monthly (or quarterly) to be able to play a game.

65

Great post, Exsea. Exactly the way I feel.
I should be quoting everything and agreeing with every single line, but it would be way too long, so I just picked the last sentence.
I did believe in LE, and to be fair I had a lot of hours of fun that I don’t regret. But it has now been completely eaten by the modern business model (no offense to EHG, if you can make a fortune, you would be silly not to), and it is not at all what it was originally announced to be, and drifting further from it with each patch.
I think I simply dislike seasonal games, they all seem to mean zero balance (because they want to change things drastically every quarter), a complete disregard for progression (only endgame matters), and a heavy reliance on build guides (because influencers bring money. Lots of it. So we have to help them.). But there is clearly a vast audience for them, and plenty of other games to play for me, so everything is fine!

Ah ah, very true.
Usually after telling us they are making a game because they want to bring back what used to be good in classic diablo-likes. Oh well, that’s marketing I guess.

I totally agree that Grim Dawn, like its father Titan Quest, is hands down the best on the market at the moment (For replayability. For a couple of playthroughs, I thought Diablo 4 was amazing, but I don’t feel like replaying it).
And I also agree that Larian somehow sticking to their values and still making a huge commercial success was a breath of fresh air. Gave me back a bit of faith in humanity.

1 Like
66

How so?

I don’t think that actually has anything to do with LE/EHG, I think that’s “just” the modern arpg landscape now. Even GD & TQ have/had build guides.

2 Likes
67

To be fair, even D2 had them, although the internet still wasn’t what it is these days. But I clearly remember seeing many build guides on gamefaqs back in the day.

68

I don’t think you are confused at all, but I appreciate a bit of innocent-seeming, disingenuousness as much as the next guy (it’s not like I would ever do that… would I? :wink:).

It’s a matter of effort and intent.

With a subscription, I’m paying to play a game. Configuring and maintaining the server is the job of the company that hires subject matter experts to do that. They have knowledge in both server architecture and operation and their own specific game-server architecture, configuration and operation. There is an opportunity for economies of scale in this model.

Renting a server, installing the game-server code, making sure it’s configured correctly, inviting all my friends to my server, etc, that all becomes my second job.

69

Maybe my perception was wrong from the start.
I was hoping it would be a game reminiscent of the classic diablo-likes of olden days. The game referenced most often in these forums as an inspiration was Diablo 2, and it was advertised as being a middle ground between Diablo 3 and PoE.
Now it doesn’t feel like a diablo-like anymore, but like a PoE-like (that’s a lot of “like” in one sentence, but you see what I mean). The focus is entirely on endgame, campaign and character progression are in limbos, and the game feels bloated with myriads of obscure items’ categories and complex crafting / mechanics after just two seasons. Pure PoE.

Of course. All games have build guides, you can’t stop influencers trying to make a few coins by publishing some.
But what did recent patches bring to LE?
1.1: a pinnacle boss, harder than anything seen before. And not much more.
1.2: an even much (very very much, from what I hear) harder boss. And some complex endgame factions and mechanics.
No new chapter, no new area to explore, every addition is high end, and complex enough to be hard to understand if you don’t read about it. Again, pure PoE.
This is a very strong incentive to use a build guide, compared to GD, TQ, Diablo 1/2/3/4 where the campaign and progression is long, simple to understand, interesting to explore and play for dozens of hour before you feel any need to look for a guide.

1 Like
70

It also was for Path of Exile, which is seen as ‘D2 +’ actually quite often.

And yes, middle ground of D3 and PoE… which it is, quite clearly so even, more so then before even, LE is vastly easier to understand, far more straight-forward and also a ton shorter then PoE.
But it’s also not as mind-numbingly dumbed down as D3 is (which can be fun, but not long usually) and still a bit longer before you go into pure repetition-mode.

The focus has to be on end-game since that was literally the weakest aspect of the game, so fixing that is obviously high on the list.

Mostly handled with some caveats that need to be addressed… Story should be finished next. Especially balance there.

Bloated gameplay? Huh? Where? And which ‘obscure or complex crafting mechanics’? You mean Nemesis maybe? Which is ‘stuff unique inside and hope for the best’? Or is it ‘hope to get better unique by putting unique with LP in’? Or rather the ‘get guaranteed shard for a guaranteed craft from a set-item which has a guaranteed outcome’?
I have no clue where you get this notion from plainly spoken.

If that’s too complex then you’ve chosen the wrong genre in itself, even D3 has more complex stuff then LE, LE is just RNG-hell, that’s a difference in terms of crafting.

Harbingers, which are a secondary boss on top of the actual boss.

Nemesis, which is a decently sized mechanic for a first addition to a game which is supposed to be released (not that LE has release state, but it’s a fitting addition).

Complex?
New end-game faction! Kill stuff and get higher level hence.
New mechanics:

  • Here have a place where you can destroy sets to get pieces of it for normal items.
  • Here have a place where you can put in LP items for gamba to get better LP items basically never.
  • Here have the most braindead easy to understand ‘tree’ one can possibly make to get more of the stuff you already get anyway.
  • Here have a way to fix your attributes if it pisses you off that you got the wrong one on a item.
  • Here have a way to re-roll values on a unique item.
  • Here’s a new way for experimental items to craft em since the old way was vastly too powerful compared to anything else.

Everything else is just ‘get more of already existing stuff’.

If you literally can’t understand ‘here’s a thing were you slap maps freely on whatever free spot’ then that’s already really baaaad.
And if you can’t understand to then bash whatever it throws against you mindlessly (while telling you exactly what to do as well by the way) then that’s double bad.

All the ‘new stuff’ does nothing related to your build. Not a single thing. The only exception is the experimental crafting which plainly spoken has become much more straight forward as you now have a guaranteed outcome and don’t need to know that you can use the glyphs to get the runes to put them into the sealed slot… which was your ultimate goal for an item after all.

Also comparing it to GD and saying it’s ‘more complex’ is absolutely wild, same with TQ which is a lot more complex crafting-wise.

So TLDR: Some style of it is against your liking, but it’s definitely not the complexity… because LE’s complexity is basically non-existent for the mechanics still, the game has no ‘depth’ like the majority of contenders on the market. It also doesn’t have the longevity with itemization pacing. But it’s decent in terms of overall available stuff, mediocre at everything, which makes it well fitted for the position.

71

I haven’t really played TQ because I couldn’t get into it, but GD’s crafting is the simplest there is:
-Get a recipe, have materials, make the item.
-Have a component, slap it on the item.

There is no complexity to it, really. You have limited ways to craft things and they’re all pretty straightforward and quite limited in what they do.

1 Like
72

The crafting in LE is:
Get random shards, slap shards on item.
Extra bonus is ‘get set shards’.
Extra other bonus is ‘put stuff onto LP item’.

That’s the complete LE crafting guide. Everything is else simply dropped.

The complete GD guide is:
Get recipe.
Get crafting material for recipe, each crafting material has a specific place to drop.
Get components, components also have specific places to drop.
And then we have the multi-step crafts needing pre-existing crafts.

That’s more complex, in LE you don’t need to know ‘where to go’, outside of the woven echoes since 1.2 now there’s ‘everything drops everywhere’… with the exception of uniques. And in GD there’s also specific items solely available from specific bosses.

Both systems have basically ‘0’ complexity.

73

I totally disagree with this. This is like saying that PoE’s crafting is simpler because it’s “Get random currency, slap currency on items”.
There are many runes and glyphs which make crafting in LE much more complext than in GD.

GD is simply following a recipe book. Yes, you sometimes need to craft elements for the craft you want, but it’s all laid out for you. You just need to read the component list, add components, get result. There’s no complexity in the crafting, you just need to get the components.

In LE, not only do you also need to get the components (which you can get from shattering gear itself, prophecies, LA, lizards, etc) but you need to decide the best way to use them.
Is it better to use a rune of removal and risk hitting your best affix or is it better to use a rune of chaos to turn it into something else? Or should you try to seal it instead?

There are lots of runes and glyphs which make crafting a much more complex problem than in GD. You actually have to think what your best approach to it is, which you don’t in GD.

So saying that GD has a more complex crafting system simply because you have to go different places to collect the components is a bit disengenuous. Because that’s not more complex, it’s just more labour-intensive.

74

It isn’t, because in PoE you need to know affix tags, you need to know where to acquire the specific crafting resources, you need to know the level requirements for the affixes and you need to know the weight of the specific affixes on top of that.

It’s a very complex one comparatively, the most complex one on the market for a reason.

Which ones? ‘I got a wrong affix, chaos glyph’ or is it the ‘always use glyph of hope to increase tiers’?
The only exception for glyphs is the glyph of order, which sustains roll-range… and is a mess since you can’t see the hidden range, hence your max roll can turn into a non max-roll if it’s on the brink as scale becomes higher the higher the tier. Which is actually badly designed and not a upside.
Despair is sealing stuff… which plainly spoken 1% of people use since the chance is quite low and the majority of time people rather run into FP problems instead of ‘hey, lemme get a sealed affix’. Specifically in 1.2 with the champion affixes it’s lost a ton of value.
Envy is a progression glyph, not a crafting one, whatever EHG thought when implementing that one is definitely a bit off.

For runes… shattering is no crafting one, refinement is basically never used since reaching the max roll is usually already a issue.
Removal is rarely used but at least it is, with a nice 75% chance to ruin your item rather then saving it.
Discovery is just nonsense outside of 1 LP crafting.
Shaping shouldn’t cost FP at all in my opinion, but would be a fair argument at least, basically also never used.
Ascendance is not a crafting item, it’s a gamble one.
Creation is basically useless outside of rings, really rarely.
Havoc and Redemption are actually decent crafting runes, that one is also new with 1.2 only… which are really… reaaaaally straight-forward too. One when your exalted is the wrong out of 4… the other when the exalted affix is simply crap.
Weaving is just a shortcut, not really crafting either.

So we got chaos, maaaybe order, maaaaybe despair, maaaaybe removal, havoc and redemption as actual usable ones.

GD’s complexity for the crafting is the acquisition of it and the knowledge based in that area.

PoE’s is both in acquisition and understanding of the system.

Torchlight’s is also partially in acquisition but mostly understanding the system.

Following a recipe doesn’t make it more or less complex, the difference is mostly that you got no fixed recipe given beforehand but instead need to make your own, but you still follow a recipe.

LE’s crafting system is very deterministic, there is no variance.

Want a rare affix? Removal as chaos won’t give it, unless you believe you’re a lucky gambler, which is general nonsense to do. Common one? Chaos. Removal also when you got a useless Affix at T5, first craft then.
When existing Affixes are handled then hope until all’s done.
Despair is only used for duplicates of already great outcomes.
For exalteds it’s easy, good exalted mod? Havoc. Bad exalted mod? Redemption before even attempting to start crafting.

Diverting from that will reduce your chance of acquiring a good item. LE’s crafting system follows a extremely deterministic road with a singular optimal outcome, the variance on initial state is relatively low and very few exceptions apply… like using removal on a 2 affix item since it’s 50/50 there, at 3 you don’t use it since the 33% chance is not worthwhile. At 2 ‘false’ affixes you don’t even attempt it anyway since FP won’t suffice.

It doesn’t matter where the thought process has to happen, it just matters that it has to happen.

Knowledge of acquisition place versus designing an optimal route with no problem for acquisition of materials is simply a different flavor. The point is how much knowledge has to flow into the respective systems.

So fair, LE is a bit higher in complexity for the direct crafting.
The complexity of GDs system comes into play with the interchanging itemization system, in LE you got ‘the item’ and that’s also ‘the end’. In GD you have 3 separate layers. Item - component - Augment. Finding working combinations of base item/prefix/suffix together with a fitting component and augment is the part which produces the complexity there, which is not a straight-forward endeavour but a puzzle-game in itself.

In LE this also exists, which is the usage of unique items (which GD also has, in a bigger variety actually) and base-types. This type of itemization is simply put more in the foregrund in GD comparatively, while LE puts the direct change of items into the foreground.

Both are ‘crafting though’. Applying a component to a item is ‘crafting’ as it changes the drop-state of said item. Same as Augmenting them.

75

Or use a rune of removal. Or seal the unwanted affix. You don’t always use chaos glyph.

Sealing an affix is one of the easiest ways to clear an unwanted affix for an exalt you want to slam.

Removal is often used instead of shatter, since with removal you always get the shards but with shatter it’s random which ones you get.
And a 75% chance to ruin your item is still better than a chaos roll most of the time, since that is usually 1/20 to hit what you want.

Chaos is actually weighted to favour rarer affixes.

That is not complex. That is like saying that Elden Ring has an extremely complex crafting system because you have to know where to get the stuff.
Or Tomb raider, where you have to combine parts of weapons and need to know where it is.

Is that your idea of a complex crafting system? Because that is not a crafting system, it’s a gathering system. It’s just an extended fetch quest.

For a crafting system to be complex, there need to be decisions involved which produce different routes towards the outcome you’re crafting towards. Which GD’s clearly doesn’t have, but both LE and PoE do.

76

Sealing the unwanted affix? Which tier? T1? 84% chance, T2? 48% chance, T3? 27% chance. So you’re outta luck when it goes beyond T2 as the chance becomes a detrimental usage comparatively to Removal already. And having that on a end-game item is more common to happen rather then not, you’ll mostly see T3+ on end-game items, rarely T2 or T1.

So yes, possible, but also just another step in the ‘optimal route’ to take into consideration. Also a guaranteed reduction of potential when done since if you’re successful… you can’t chance on that lucky T4 sealing anymore.

At low tier, otherwise it’s a detrimental approach chance-wise.

We’re talking about crafting the item, not about acquisition of the shards. You don’t generally craft items where you want to get the shards from, you at best use it afterwards in hope to recover already used resources.

Also not quite true as chaos rolls are done with common mods, hence to get ‘a useful affix’ is doable for those. As mentioned, for a rare Affix removal is automatically the better option since it’s not a 1/20 but a 1/200 or more chance. Affixes have weight applied, even with the chaos allowing them to be more prevalent.

Which is neither good nor bad, because the chance to acquire a rare affix is still lower then a common one, and with the prevalence in number of common affixes it makes it still less likely to win then to loose if you search for one specific Affix.

Early on definitely an option, end-game not.

Elden Ring has a complex item acquisition system, not a complex crafting system. You don’t change the base-state of items there, you solely improve them numerically, that’s it. Difference between ‘upgrade’ and ‘crafting’.
If you don’t change the item but simply improve all numerical rolls then it’s solely upgrading. Only the change to specific elements is crafting in Elden Ring.

Also as well as in Elden Ring and Tomb Raider the goal is to explore basically everything, which makes acquisition a guarantee basically, not a exception. Some secret areas being the exception for that, but that’s part of the exploration difficulty, not the crafting one.

Repetition of already finished content for the sake of acquisition of crafting materials on the other hand is a form of crafting difficulty as it needs the knowledge to remember it existing (information retention) while one-time acquisition is not a crafting aspect but solely a exploration one in comparison.

77

You were the one that was including the acquiring of components as part of the crafting complexity.

Using ashes to change the weapon would like to disagree.

Yes. Difficulty. Difficult != complex.

If they make Uby drop a rune that can upgrade any affix to T7, that is not complex, just difficult.
Having to use havoc or redemption isn’t difficult, it’s part of the complexity.
They’re different meanings and I think you’re mixing up the two.

78

Then take the context into consideration. LE has no difficulty for acquisition of shards as ‘everything is everywhere’ as mentioned.

The exception is set-shards.

Otherwise the acquisition of Gold would also need to fall into the GD crafting discussion, but I didn’t do that for a reason.

Fair

Badly worded.
The amount of needed information retention is directly correlated to complexity for the brain. If loads of information is available which needs to be retained to achieve a specific outcome then that’s complexity basically.

Complexity can create difficulty but difficulty is not entirely dependant on complexity.

In GD you need information retention, in LE you don’t for the acquisition. That’s hence a difference in complexity.

Comparatively during crafting in GD you don’t need to remember things as it’s as you said a ‘fixed recipe’ while in LE you do need to retain information, which is a form of complexity there.

79

Not bloated gameplay, no. Bloated mechanics.
That’s precisely the problem: nothing is added to the gameplay, no new areas or things to do, but we add more and more unnecessary mechanics. It feels overwhelming for no reason.

Each dungeon MUST have a unique mechanic to learn, used only in this dungeon. Guaranteeing that we will always have a very small amount of dungeons to visit.

We used to have common, magical, rare, exalted and unique items. Pretty standard.
Then came legendaries.
Followed by experimental. Then personal. Then weaver.
Bloated, for absolutely no reason as it doesn’t add anything to the gameplay.

After that, factions came along. With their own currency, favour, and the need to learn how to earn and use it. Prophecies. Stuff you can buy to enhance your prophecies. A dozen merchants guild’s vendors to do the job of one.
Harbingers. Why on earth do they need a faction, apart from making things unnecessary unclear? Kill enough harbingers, unlock Abby, done. No need for a special confusing screen.
Now Weaver.
Bloated. And again, completely unrelated to gameplay. Complexity for the sake of complexity.

And crafting.
As you mentioned, only 3-4 runes are truely useful. But we have about 12, and more keep coming. Just to look more complex, as the gameplay itself doesn’t change. That is the very definition of bloated.

Of course, taken separately, each of these points is relatively easy to understand.
But put together in a game with limited gameplay options, it feels far too much.

PoE also has a lot of mechanics. Probably even more than LE. But each of them, in each season, comes with specific gameplay. Different things to do, to justify the new mechanics.
In LE, the gameplay aspect has been forgotten (temporarily, one can hope) and mechanics keep appearing for their own sake.

Probably the only bit I agree with, and that was my point to begin with.
I thought LE belonged to a genre I love, diablo-likes. But now it has moved into a genre I don’t enjoy that much.

1 Like
80

We got several new bosses.
We got a whole randomly generated area solely for the new content which is attached to existing content to do if you want or leave if you don’t.
We got several new layouts in some of the woven echoes which haven’t been seen before.
We got a whole brewery with specific enemies only in there, a small boss only in there with a distinct drop only existing there.

I mean… 1.2 offered a ton of new gameplay, specifically new areas and new things to do…

Yes, that should be the norm, and has been utterly messed up by EHG :stuck_out_tongue: Which is why they let us skip it now or simply throw tons of lizards in to at least make it somewhat stomachable.
Disgusting approach in my book, I agree there.

Not bloated, close to it though.

And the reason is obvious: Build depth.
Since that was missing in the game, and still shows struggles.

In games a vast amount of enjoyment comes from improving your character, at least in RPGs. This is handled via a so called ‘cadence of upgrades’.
This concept is to establish how often and in what timeframe a character will have a significant felt improvement of some kind. Not a ‘1% increased fire damage’ one but one which feels like it’s worthwhile.

This cadence exists in every single ARPG, D2, 3, 4… they all have it, D3 is under flak for providing too little, D4 for frontloading it and then enforcing long-term repetitive tasks without any reliable outcomes (dungeon runs) to the player.
In Torchlight Infinite it’s very good since it’s based on a mixture of dropping items and crafting them gradually.
In PoE you get tons of possible drops with possible upgrades as well as the resources to do that. If you as a player ever have more then 5 hours in the first 100 play hours without a single significant upgrade then you’ve simply missed out on the available options (which is easy to happen). In the first 200 hours it doesn’t go ever beyond 10 hours investment, at a ‘normal’ pace mind you.

In LE in comparison? The first 20 hours you get items shoved into you left and right. Blessings, Idols, upgrades galore, everywhere, tons of em… and then suddenly a drought. First 5+ hours, then 40+ hours then 100+ hours.
A bad state, undermining the basic progression usually felt in the genre. Which is why EHG uses those methods to ‘spread out’ the potential upgrades.

With a high variance system you mandatorily need respective amounts of venues to have upgrades, so each one has a reliable chance and the variety for a better end-result is achieved easier.

Yep, the player factions are a mess, it’s where EHG started to loose it plainly spoken.

Agreed, absolute nonsense from EHGs side.

Weaver makes sense though for being a end-game faction. The tree and the acquisition of items there does make proper sense, unlike with Harbingers which could simply be showcased as a single stat at the monolith screen bottom they are a bit more complex. So that’s fine.

Yes, crafting in LE is massively bloated and extremely underperforming. They wanted to go a similar route with options like PoE did, with changing implicits… or re-rolling values.
Their FP system ruins that entirely as an option though and makes them utterly useless.

Outside of Weaver I absolutely agree.
EHG still ‘doesn’t have it down’.
We can see it easily at Dungeons, rather then improving on a working concept they shoved it into the background, reducing variety of gameplay options through that further rather then using it to enhance them.

Weaver is good, weaver works, it’s good variety… but why the heck does LP re-roll need to be in there? That’s fitting for Nemesis, not for the weaver.
Also Experimental shouldn’t happen there, it’s supposed to be with exiled mages specifically, so a option to get that through their fights at the end would’ve been simpler, more straight-forward and without bloat of a extra area that’s utterly annoying to deal with (and not because it’s hard, but because you have to do several mage fights which are now worthless for anything else then the laddle).

It’s still a diablo-like, and the best of the genre clearly showcasing and advancing that are PoE 1 and Grim Dawn… maybe in the future Torchlight, if they stop their disgusting p2w stuff.
LE is just ever further ‘badly executed’. Why? It feels decent for a while, good start! But the fundamentals are not stable, EHG never fixed their base game and brought it into a state where they can say 'Yes, for the next 2 years our base systems are rock solid and we can expand on the game before needing to merge stuff back together.

MG breaks left and right. CoF is overdesigned UI-wise. Dungeons are a disaster, positioning of several mechanics are simply ‘wrong’ for a lack of another term and the mentioned bloat for the Factions is massive. Utter nonsense at times.

81

Ah, that’s good to hear, and I stand corrected.
I uninstalled after playing a little bit in 1.1, when I saw that the new roadmap had completely given up on the campaign and was centered on yet another pinnacle.

No intention at all to play 1.2, unlikely for 1.3.
When I come back in 1.4 or 1.5 I certainly hope to see new stuff to do!
:crossed_fingers:

1 Like