In conversations I have had with others on the boards it has occured to me that many people have wildly different views of what “good” damage is, so if one person says a skill is trash because it does x damage or a build is not viable because of damage yet others might think that the damage it is putting out is good. I am not sure if this is because of a lack of communication, people not having tried different builds or what, but it would be nice to come to somewhat of a consensus of what good damage is.
What does everyone think good damage is? or even Viable damage? I would like to hear what others think. This can be seperated out to both single attack and DoT damage, also is the skill AoE or a pure single target?
This cannot be quantified in the current state of the game.
There is literally no benchmark that is widelay accepted among all kinds of palyers to give any hard facts.
Neither damage numbers nor tooltips dps are sufficient key data for this.
I already suggested different trainings dummies with fixed amounts of health pools, that are tagged as “enemy”, so every minions/skill/proc works against them.
maybe 2-3 different ones (very similar to waht Marvel Heroes did)
And with those you could measure the TTK for all of them, to give good values for burst dmg, and sustained damage.
Doing more damage to the mob before it takes your life to 0… Simple equation really. Now if you want to talk about the press one button shatter all reality and kill everything except yourself a couple of screens away then that is what PoE is for.
It is more of the fact I am asking what people feel like good damage is as this makes it much easier to discuss skills with people. To give an example I have seen people argue with me that a skill hitting for 7k was great damage on a skill, where as I think 7k is utter trash. This would just make it easier when people say something like “ohh this skill does 10k and hits every 2 seconds costing 40 mana its great!” people would then be able to look at it and compare it with other classes and skills.
For instance if you have X skill say on mage, it forces you to stand still for 1 second for a cast and does 20k damage and costs 30 mana I feel thats not worth it when I can compare to my lich that hits for a 20k a tic spreading dot that costs 8 mana for the same 1 second cast. or my rogue that hits for 60-80k crits every time in 2 different massive AoE and gets mana back for using the skill as well as it moves them and is up every 1.5 to 2 seconds or less.
I guess I come from a different skill of thinking on this. If I can face tank out any incoming damage, should I care if my Rive on that Pally does only 30k tooltip DPS since nothing can kill it in its present state. Unless I let it die.
People’s perception of “I deal X amount of damage in Y amount of seconds” will already be very subjective, because humans are bad at how fast/often they hit within a certain timeframe.
Also it’s about damage projection.
Don’t get me wrong, i would love to have something to compare, not for comparing it with other players, but to see what different varitions of skills can do.
I just really do fear that any kind of quantified damage analysis will lead to toxicity, once MP/Online is there.
I think it depends on the type of skill being used. Playing Warpath? You probably want to see the hp bar move steadily down at a decent pace (I understand that pace is what you want defined, but hear me out.)
Playing Warpath to proc Holy Aura’s fire explosion? You probably want to see that explosion’s damage has sufficiently chunked out the boss or mob.
What is a decent pace, and what is a sufficient chunk?
I want my proc to go off once or twice on the Wengari Patriarch in order to kill him. For the smooth dps to be similar, it needs to happen in the time of 16 Warpath ticks, or 15 seconds.
I also think that currently as there is no proper training dummy and you see them often enough, that the Wengari bosses are a good meter to test your damage against. You don’t have to be in a specific monolith to find them, and as long as you factor the mono mods in, everyone can see what their effective hp is, therefore knowing what your dps realistically looks like.
This is more of the answer I am looking for. You can somewhat compare damage on the training dummy as well just by looking at the amount of damage over a specific time, say 10 seconds. with this I am able to see my skeleton rogue has hits on average 12-13 times for an average hit of 550 with a crit of 1500 every 5ish swings. I am then able to multiply that by 10 - 12 rogues depending on what items I am using. Discounting the crits at the moment my skele rogues do 750ish dps each multiplied by my amount of rogues, on the low end of 10 my rogues do 7.5k dps roughly. Now if I also look at my 5 deathknights who also do around the same damage of 550 with 17 hits in 10 seconds but at a much higher crit rate which at the moment i will ignore. I am able to now see this as they do roughly 935 dps each for a total of 4675 total dps (again discounting crits). Now, this is with very very good gear but the main 2 things of the build, skeletons and deathknights only do roughly 12k dps and only if they are attacking the same target, this seems extremely low. Especially when compared to say my lich build with soul plague hitting for on average 4500 a total of 21 times in 10 seconds with a dps of 9450 that spreads to everything on screen and hits everything for the same 9.5k dps to everything, damage going up exponentially with the amount of mobs on screen. If i also get close enough for Aura of Decay to also hit the damage goes up by over double with average being 11-12k at the same 21 times in 10 seconds so roughly 23k dps from 2 spells to anything even remotely close to me
at present, there really isn’t any content in the game with a timer on it, so “good” damage can basically mean “any amount of damage that would allow you to clear content given an infinite amount of time”
if they were to make it to where you had to clear each arena floor within 60 seconds or so, then the definition of good damage would be based on who can clear those floors the fastest without dying.
